Filed under: Growing Orchids
Question:
Hi Gid, Long time no see. New Years? Anyhow, thanks for the feedback. WC’d plants LOVE algae. It purifies the water, oxygenates it. Sue removes some of it out on occasion but the jars are never cleaned of it. -Rod- – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’d like to hear how others fared as I know quite a lot of people have tried it. The WC document is THE most requested by orchid societies for reprinting in their newsletters. -Rod- Rod, I did use it for a while on the following genera: Zygopetalum, Coel, and Phrag. I had good results, but in the end they declined and I was forced to put them into conventional media where none have recovered to any great extent. I had a problem with string algae that was introduced from my fish pond and in my attempts to get rid of it I may have "poisoned" the plants. I also decided to get down to one or two types of media rather an than four or more. As it is I still have too many types of media in my gh!:)
– Rod C. Venger – Head and Neck Cancer Support T4N0M0 – Facial Reconstructions, 2-5-99, 3-13-00 Photo and info: http:/www.vengers.com/model.jpg Sponsors needed for HNO documentary! Call 1-800-483-6437
Response:
But for oncids, dens, catts, phals and about 1/2 dozen others, the water culture has far exceeded pot culture.
How do you give a den. a dry winter rest in water culture?
Response:
Oddly, you don’t. This was a question at one time, but it works out and they bloom. -Rod- But for oncids, dens, catts, phals and about 1/2 dozen others, the water culture has far exceeded pot culture. How do you give a den. a dry winter rest in water culture?
– Rod C. Venger – Head and Neck Cancer Support T4N0M0 – Facial Reconstructions, 2-5-99, 3-13-00 Photo and info: http:/www.vengers.com/model.jpg Sponsors needed for HNO documentary! Call 1-800-483-6437
Response:
Same is true in S/H! — Ray Barkalow < First Rays Orchids http://www.firstrays.com Secure Online Ordering & Lots of Free Info! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Oddly, you don’t. This was a question at one time, but it works out and they bloom. -Rod- But for oncids, dens, catts, phals and about 1/2 dozen others, the water culture has far exceeded pot culture. How do you give a den. a dry winter rest in water culture? — Rod C. Venger – Head and Neck Cancer Support T4N0M0 – Facial Reconstructions, 2-5-99, 3-13-00 Photo and info: http:/www.vengers.com/model.jpg Sponsors needed for HNO documentary! Call 1-800-483-6437
Response:
What is this culture method??? Kye.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well, I finally saw it. About a year ago someone came online here and asked how phals can survive submerged in water. S/He said that’s was how a floral display was shown in an open house. Well this month’s (Jan 02) Architectural Digest has a floral display exactly like that in one of their stories. The phal is bareroot, completely submerged under about a foot of water, inside a large clear glass vase. Only the inflorescence is gracefully arching up out of the vase and into the air. There’s a few decorative smooth stones at the bottom of the vase, just for visual interest. At the time the poster asked how the phal can survive this treatment. My answer, now that I’ve seen it, is that it can’t. One takes the attitude that the phal is disposable in that instance, like any flower stalk. But of course Phals are such contrary creatures that it would probably love it and bloom even better the next time around. LOL!! K Barrett Sorry, they not only survive but flourish. This is an old technic of water culture which was revived a few years back by Rod Venger. It works very well on several genera, especially oncidiums and phals. I have grown phals in water culture, just to see if it works, and over a 4 year period they grew, and flowered on time and developed a root system so extensive it was difficult to get them out of the glass jar. I stopped growing them this way only because, for me, it was inconvenient in the green house.
Response:
How about scanning and posting the picture to abpo? Pretty please? — Reka http://www.rolbox.it/hukari/index.html "I hate flowers – I paint them because they’re cheaper than models and they don’t move." –Georgia O’Keeffe | Well, I finally saw it. About a year ago someone came online here and | asked how phals can survive submerged in water. S/He said that’s was how | a floral display was shown in an open house. | | Well this month’s (Jan 02) Architectural Digest has a floral display | exactly like that in one of their stories.
Response:
Kye, If you’re talking about water culture, see the page at http://vengers.com/culture/water.htm It’s a safe and proven technique, as Wil attested to. I couldn’t comment on the totally submerged idea. I do know that Oncids and Dens leaves will not rot if submerged. Phals? You’d have to try to find out. -Rod- – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What is this culture method??? Kye. Well, I finally saw it. About a year ago someone came online here and asked how phals can survive submerged in water. S/He said that’s was how a floral display was shown in an open house. Well this month’s (Jan 02) Architectural Digest has a floral display exactly like that in one of their stories. The phal is bareroot, completely submerged under about a foot of water, inside a large clear glass vase. Only the inflorescence is gracefully arching up out of the vase and into the air. There’s a few decorative smooth stones at the bottom of the vase, just for visual interest. At the time the poster asked how the phal can survive this treatment. My answer, now that I’ve seen it, is that it can’t. One takes the attitude that the phal is disposable in that instance, like any flower stalk. But of course Phals are such contrary creatures that it would probably love it and bloom even better the next time around. LOL!! K Barrett Sorry, they not only survive but flourish. This is an old technic of water culture which was revived a few years back by Rod Venger. It works very well on several genera, especially oncidiums and phals. I have grown phals in water culture, just to see if it works, and over a 4 year period they grew, and flowered on time and developed a root system so extensive it was difficult to get them out of the glass jar. I stopped growing them this way only because, for me, it was inconvenient in the green house.
– Rod C. Venger – Head and Neck Cancer Support T4N0M0 – Facial Reconstructions, 2-5-99, 3-13-00 Photo and info: http:/www.vengers.com/model.jpg Sponsors needed for HNO documentary! Call 1-800-483-6437
Response:
Rod, Do you just take the plant out of the jar and snip off the dead ones? I mean, they will rot and the water will go bad otherwise, right? — Reka http://www.rolbox.it/hukari/index.html "I hate flowers – I paint them because they’re cheaper than models and they don’t move." –Georgia O’Keeffe | | Hi Andrew, | | Lots of people should, if they haven’t tried it yet. A jar, a plant, | that’s all you need. The doc is at http://vengers.com/culture/water.htm | and if you have any questions as things go on, feel free to ask. If the | roots die at first, don’t panic. New ones generally grow in quickly. -Rod-
Response:
Hi Rod, to answer your question of a few weeks ago: Yes. My Vanda coerulea is in pot of water.I change the water about every 2 months, when it gets too slimy green. Contrary to what I said: my ascocenda is doing well in a pot of water. Ed Cormier
Response:
Hi Reka, We never really felt the need to snip them, no. The pieces of the old "pot" roots would flush out when we watered. Eventually those roots are replaced by roots that will not rot. -Rod- – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Rod, Do you just take the plant out of the jar and snip off the dead ones? I mean, they will rot and the water will go bad otherwise, right? — Reka http://www.rolbox.it/hukari/index.html "I hate flowers – I paint them because they’re cheaper than models and they don’t move." –Georgia O’Keeffe | | Hi Andrew, | | Lots of people should, if they haven’t tried it yet. A jar, a plant, | that’s all you need. The doc is at http://vengers.com/culture/water.htm | and if you have any questions as things go on, feel free to ask. If the | roots die at first, don’t panic. New ones generally grow in quickly. -Rod-
– Rod C. Venger – Head and Neck Cancer Support T4N0M0 – Facial Reconstructions, 2-5-99, 3-13-00 Photo and info: http:/www.vengers.com/model.jpg Sponsors needed for HNO documentary! Call 1-800-483-6437
Response:
Sorry, they not only survive but flourish. This is an old technic of water culture which was revived a few years back by Rod Venger. It works very well on several genera, especially oncidiums and phals.
K Barrett’s posting says the plant was completely submerged except for the inflorescence. That’s a bit more extreme that Rod’s water culture. deg
Response:
What about crown rot? though I suppose if the leaves were free of bacteria when submerged that wouldn’t happen…or would it? One thing for sure, you wouldn’t have to worry about aphids, mealies and probably not scale either! One more thing, Kathy, was the underwater Phal. the type with the heavy green leaves or the thin, succulent-leaved type like the violaceas? the latter (for me at least) develop problems if you look at them cross- eyed, even the roots seem tender. I wonder if the water was RO or tap? cheers Sue
Sorry, they not only survive but flourish. This is an old technic of water culture which was revived a few years back by Rod Venger. It works very well on several genera, especially oncidiums and phals. K Barrett’s posting says the plant was completely submerged except for the inflorescence. That’s a bit more extreme that Rod’s water culture. deg
– Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server – http://www.Mailgate.ORG
Response:
What about crown rot? though I suppose if the leaves were free of bacteria when submerged that wouldn’t happen…or would it? One thing for sure, you wouldn’t have to worry about aphids, mealies and probably not scale either!
Hotdog! Finally a way to prevent scale! deg
Response:
I’m afraid i did not read the post carefully. I agree it is not likely the phal would survive completely submerged. I was talking about water culture with only the base in water. Wilford Neptune
Response:
Wil, I’m sorry to hear you had to stop. Be very glad that it worked well for you 
-Rod- Sorry, they not only survive but flourish. This is an old technic of water culture which was revived a few years back by Rod Venger. It works very well on several genera, especially oncidiums and phals. I have grown phals in water culture, just to see if it works, and over a 4 year period they grew, and flowered on time and developed a root system so extensive it was difficult to get them out of the glass jar. I stopped growing them this way only because, for me, it was inconvenient in the green house.
– Rod C. Venger – Head and Neck Cancer Support T4N0M0 – Facial Reconstructions, 2-5-99, 3-13-00 Photo and info: http:/www.vengers.com/model.jpg Sponsors needed for HNO documentary! Call 1-800-483-6437
Response:
Yes, totally submerged. Weird, huh? As a fashion statement it looked pretty cool, though. K – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m afraid i did not read the post carefully. I agree it is not likely the phal would survive completely submerged. I was talking about water culture with only the base in water. Wilford Neptune
Response:
Dark leaves, it was a white phal. I think it used magnetized water… (*G*) K – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What about crown rot? though I suppose if the leaves were free of bacteria when submerged that wouldn’t happen…or would it? One thing for sure, you wouldn’t have to worry about aphids, mealies and probably not scale either! One more thing, Kathy, was the underwater Phal. the type with the heavy green leaves or the thin, succulent-leaved type like the violaceas? the latter (for me at least) develop problems if you look at them cross- eyed, even the roots seem tender. I wonder if the water was RO or tap? cheers Sue Sorry, they not only survive but flourish. This is an old technic of water culture which was revived a few years back by Rod Venger. It works very well on several genera, especially oncidiums and phals. K Barrett’s posting says the plant was completely submerged except for the inflorescence. That’s a bit more extreme that Rod’s water culture. deg — Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server – http://www.Mailgate.ORG
Response:
Hi Andrew, Lots of people should, if they haven’t tried it yet. A jar, a plant, that’s all you need. The doc is at http://vengers.com/culture/water.htm and if you have any questions as things go on, feel free to ask. If the roots die at first, don’t panic. New ones generally grow in quickly. -Rod- – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thanks Rod, Sounds like it’s definitely worth trying out. I guess I’ll finally get off my overly cautious backside and give it a go. Andrew Hi Andrew, 1995 was when we started I think. For some genera it was just so-so. But for oncids, dens, catts, phals and about 1/2 dozen others, the water culture has far exceeded pot culture. They grow faster, bloom as well or (in most cases I believe) better than in pots, and the root systems, as Wil Neptune pointed out, are just huge, much bigger than in conventional media. We take divisions off of WC’d plants at probably 3x the rate as potted, and those divisions get divided as well. The experiment was a success and we still use WC on our own personal plants. I’d like to hear how others fared as I know quite a lot of people have tried it. The WC document is THE most requested by orchid societies for reprinting in their newsletters. -Rod-
– Rod C. Venger – Head and Neck Cancer Support T4N0M0 – Facial Reconstructions, 2-5-99, 3-13-00 Photo and info: http:/www.vengers.com/model.jpg Sponsors needed for HNO documentary! Call 1-800-483-6437
Response:
I’d like to hear how others fared as I know quite a lot of people have tried it. The WC document is THE most requested by orchid societies for reprinting in their newsletters. -Rod-
Rod, I did use it for a while on the following genera: Zygopetalum, Coel, and Phrag. I had good results, but in the end they declined and I was forced to put them into conventional media where none have recovered to any great extent. I had a problem with string algae that was introduced from my fish pond and in my attempts to get rid of it I may have "poisoned" the plants. I also decided to get down to one or two types of media rather an than four or more. As it is I still have too many types of media in my gh!:) — Gideon Singer In Beautiful wet Vancouver BC
Response:
Thanks Rod, Sounds like it’s definitely worth trying out. I guess I’ll finally get off my overly cautious backside and give it a go. Andrew – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Andrew, 1995 was when we started I think. For some genera it was just so-so. But for oncids, dens, catts, phals and about 1/2 dozen others, the water culture has far exceeded pot culture. They grow faster, bloom as well or (in most cases I believe) better than in pots, and the root systems, as Wil Neptune pointed out, are just huge, much bigger than in conventional media. We take divisions off of WC’d plants at probably 3x the rate as potted, and those divisions get divided as well. The experiment was a success and we still use WC on our own personal plants. I’d like to hear how others fared as I know quite a lot of people have tried it. The WC document is THE most requested by orchid societies for reprinting in their newsletters. -Rod-
Response:
Hi Andrew, 1995 was when we started I think. For some genera it was just so-so. But for oncids, dens, catts, phals and about 1/2 dozen others, the water culture has far exceeded pot culture. They grow faster, bloom as well or (in most cases I believe) better than in pots, and the root systems, as Wil Neptune pointed out, are just huge, much bigger than in conventional media. We take divisions off of WC’d plants at probably 3x the rate as potted, and those divisions get divided as well. The experiment was a success and we still use WC on our own personal plants. I’d like to hear how others fared as I know quite a lot of people have tried it. The WC document is THE most requested by orchid societies for reprinting in their newsletters. -Rod- If you’re talking about water culture, see the page at http://vengers.com/culture/water.htm It’s a safe and proven technique, as Wil attested to. Hi Rod, I noticed that you first started growing orchids like this a few years ago with everyone at the time saying how great their results were. Now that a few years have passed how have the plants faired over the longer period (years)? Are they still growing as well as when you first put them in water? Do they still compare well with plants grown along side them in pots? Andrew
– Rod C. Venger – Head and Neck Cancer Support T4N0M0 – Facial Reconstructions, 2-5-99, 3-13-00 Photo and info: http:/www.vengers.com/model.jpg Sponsors needed for HNO documentary! Call 1-800-483-6437
Response:
If you’re talking about water culture, see the page at http://vengers.com/culture/water.htm It’s a safe and proven technique, as Wil attested to.
Hi Rod, I noticed that you first started growing orchids like this a few years ago with everyone at the time saying how great their results were. Now that a few years have passed how have the plants faired over the longer period (years)? Are they still growing as well as when you first put them in water? Do they still compare well with plants grown along side them in pots? Andrew
Response:
It not a culture method. Its a floral arrangement. K – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What is this culture method??? Kye. Well, I finally saw it. About a year ago someone came online here and asked how phals can survive submerged in water. S/He said that’s was how a floral display was shown in an open house. Well this month’s (Jan 02) Architectural Digest has a floral display exactly like that in one of their stories. The phal is bareroot, completely submerged under about a foot of water, inside a large clear glass vase. Only the inflorescence is gracefully arching up out of the vase and into the air. There’s a few decorative smooth stones at the bottom of the vase, just for visual interest. At the time the poster asked how the phal can survive this treatment. My answer, now that I’ve seen it, is that it can’t. One takes the attitude that the phal is disposable in that instance, like any flower stalk. But of course Phals are such contrary creatures that it would probably love it and bloom even better the next time around. LOL!! K Barrett Sorry, they not only survive but flourish. This is an old technic of water culture which was revived a few years back by Rod Venger. It works very well on several genera, especially oncidiums and phals. I have grown phals in water culture, just to see if it works, and over a 4 year period they grew, and flowered on time and developed a root system so extensive it was difficult to get them out of the glass jar. I stopped growing them this way only because, for me, it was inconvenient in the green house.
Response:
Well, I finally saw it. About a year ago someone came online here and asked how phals can survive submerged in water. S/He said that’s was how a floral display was shown in an open house. Well this month’s (Jan 02) Architectural Digest has a floral display exactly like that in one of their stories. The phal is bareroot, completely submerged under about a foot of water, inside a large clear glass vase. Only the inflorescence is gracefully arching up out of the vase and into the air. There’s a few decorative smooth stones at the bottom of the vase, just for visual interest. At the time the poster asked how the phal can survive this treatment. My answer, now that I’ve seen it, is that it can’t. One takes the attitude that the phal is disposable in that instance, like any flower stalk. But of course Phals are such contrary creatures that it would probably love it and bloom even better the next time around. LOL!! K Barrett Sorry, they not only survive but flourish. This is an old technic of water culture which was revived a few years back by Rod Venger. It works very well on several genera, especially oncidiums and phals. I have grown phals in water culture, just to see if it works, and over a 4 year period they grew, and flowered on time and developed a root system so extensive it was difficult to get them out of the glass jar. I stopped growing them this way only because, for me, it was inconvenient in the green house.
Response:
Well, I finally saw it. About a year ago someone came online here and asked how phals can survive submerged in water. S/He said that’s was how a floral display was shown in an open house. Well this month’s (Jan 02) Architectural Digest has a floral display exactly like that in one of their stories. The phal is bareroot, completely submerged under about a foot of water, inside a large clear glass vase. Only the inflorescence is gracefully arching up out of the vase and into the air. There’s a few decorative smooth stones at the bottom of the vase, just for visual interest. At the time the poster asked how the phal can survive this treatment. My answer, now that I’ve seen it, is that it can’t. One takes the attitude that the phal is disposable in that instance, like any flower stalk. But of course Phals are such contrary creatures that it would probably love it and bloom even better the next time around. LOL!! K Barrett
Response:
Question:
I have a plant ( a Christieara ), which is Aerides (Vanda) flabellata x Ascnda Aroonsri Beauty. I’m growing it in an EastSoutheast window. It gets about 4 hours direct sun every clear morning and shares the window with about 40 orchids. I water it every three days thoroughly with 15-30-15 plant food at the rate of 1/4 teaspoon per gallon. I have a one gallon pump sprayer, just plain water and use that to spray it everyday. My relative humidity is rather low (between 40% and 50%) and the orchid is planted in large chunk fir bark, which dries quickly. It’s going to flower soon, it’s first time for me. My plant is not a pure Ascnda, but perhaps my information will give you some ideas. Hope so, anyway. I’m no expert, but I wouldn’t think that two individuals of the same plant species would require different cultural treatment. Bob – Philadelphia, Pa
Response:
Bob, Why couldn’t two plants of the same hybrid have different needs? Genetics tells us that traits in offspring are distributed in a bell-curve, and the two plants that you are comparing might be from opposite ends of the curves for the traits you are seeing. Yeah, the vast majority are going to be similar – hence the tell middle of the bell – but it’s no guarantee that yours are up there. — Ray Barkalow < First Rays Orchids http://www.firstrays.com Secure Online Ordering & Lots of Free Info!
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a plant ( a Christieara ), which is Aerides (Vanda) flabellata x Ascnda Aroonsri Beauty. I’m growing it in an EastSoutheast window. It gets about 4 hours direct sun every clear morning and shares the window with about 40 orchids. I water it every three days thoroughly with 15-30-15 plant food at the rate of 1/4 teaspoon per gallon. I have a one gallon pump sprayer, just plain water and use that to spray it everyday. My relative humidity is rather low (between 40% and 50%) and the orchid is planted in large chunk fir bark, which dries quickly. It’s going to flower soon, it’s first time for me. My plant is not a pure Ascnda, but perhaps my information will give you some ideas. Hope so, anyway. I’m no expert, but I wouldn’t think that two individuals of the same plant species would require different cultural treatment. Bob – Philadelphia, Pa
Response:
I have about 100 Vandacous orchids, such as your Ascda. Your plant is a cross between an Ascda and Vanda. You can not water that plant enough. In the summer I oftem water twice a day. Early morning and mid afternoon. In the winter I reduce to every morning sometimes skipping a day. They also crave fertilizer. I would hit the plant with a "Superthrive" at 1/4" teaspoon/gallon, ease it into some strong light and watch it carefully. Don’t pot it in anything. Hang it from a wire or use a plastic of wood basket. At most use some charcoal and Alaflor as a medium in a Basket not a pot. Don’t be afraid to water. Just don’t water in late afternoon, you want the roots to turn green and to be able to dry out. If the leaves are dark green, its not getting enough light. You want a pale green, especailly on new growth at the crown. DON’T CUT ANY ROOTS until this plant is VERY healthy. I believe that Vandas are the easiest to grow and some of the the most beutiful orchids. If you come to Miami, you should vist Fuch’s, its a great place. (they give free lemonaid) You can expect Ascda’s to bloom at least twice a year. If you’re lucky 4 times. But thats alot of luck.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Let me preface this with: I know almost nothing about orchids. I got this one because I rescued it from the garbage can. The plant was given to me with a label that reads Ascda. Fuchs Sunset X V. Denisoniana-Yellow. My grand mother had two of them. She had both in hanging baskets in medium light. They were misted once a day. The one she still has was doing beautifully. The one she gave me apparently died on her, and she threw it in the trash. Fortunately she doesn’t empty the garbage in the gardening room very often. Two weeks later, I went to throw something away and noticed a rather green plant in the trash. I pulled it out and saw new root growth near the base of the plant. I will admit that a lot of the roots were dried and very dead looking, but the plant was doing better in the dark dry trash can under the table than it had when it was being taken care of. As far as I understood from her, the plant was a hybrid. Is is possible that two of the same species require such different care? Or that in being a hybrid it ended up with different characteristics than its sibling? She aquired them from a man who used to breed orchids and is now passed when his widow couldn’t care for them. Any thoughts or advice on what I can do to keep it alive are welcome. Thank You.
Response:
Has the medium light caused the other plant to bloom or not? Were they really both labeled Ascda. Fuchs Sunset? There are so many different types of orchids and different potting styles it is hard to say with out your identifying the second plant. The Ascda. you have will not bloom without strong light. The roots of many orchids have a quite dead look if they are not observed when watered. They will look white or gray as long as they are dry. IF they are plump and not shriveled, broken, or mushy they should be assumed to be good. Any root with a small green tip is definitely currently active and growing. Misting once a day will not produce enough water to keep such a plant growing healthily either. If both plants are Ascada. they both need to be watered and allowed to drain at least once a week. What they are potted in or mounted on will determine if they need more water than that. Misting is an attempt to raise the humidity around the plant. It normally provides next to no water to the plant, just prevents dehydration by evaporation. These plants normally grow in well lighted greenhouses or warm areas where they get strong light daily. They can bloom several times a year. I am not familiar enough with the Vandas to know the effects that a cross back to a vanda will have on the normal easy to care for Ascda. If you have a green house **slowly** move this to the brightest corner. **Slowly** they can sunburn just as we do with to rapid a move from shade to sun. If it is in a basket – wooden slots wired together at the corners. Dunk it twice weekly then hang up to dry. If your plant area is below 50% humidity try to increase the humidity. A fish tank air pump will create a little mist pool when the hose ends with a bubble stone that is dropped in a glass of water. Misting with a spray bottle is considered one of the least effective over the time span of a day. A humidifier, a mister spray system, trays of gravel with water under and around the stones all can help as can other plants nearby. Ortho has a good inexpensive book on growing orchids. Also most libraries carry Rebecca Northern’s book on Orchids as houseplants. Please return if you have more questions or details. SuE – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Let me preface this with: I know almost nothing about orchids. I got this one because I rescued it from the garbage can. The plant was given to me with a label that reads Ascda. Fuchs Sunset X V. Denisoniana-Yellow. My grandmother had two of them. She had both in hanging baskets in medium light. They were misted once a day. The one she still has was doing beautifully. The one she gave me apparently died on her, and she threw it in the trash. Fortunately she doesn’t empty the garbage in the gardening room very often. Two weeks later, I went to throw something away and noticed a rather green plant in the trash. I pulled it out and saw new root growth near the base of the plant. I will admit that a lot of the roots were dried and very dead looking, but the plant was doing better in the dark dry trash can under the table than it had when it was being taken care of. As far as I understood from her, the plant was a hybrid. Is is possible that two of the same species require such different care? Or that in being a hybrid it ended up with different characteristics than its sibling? She aquired them from a man who used to breed orchids and is now passed when his widow couldn’t care for them. Any thoughts or advice on what I can do to keep it alive are welcome. Thank You.
Response:
Let me preface this with: I know almost nothing about orchids. I got this one because I rescued it from the garbage can. The plant was given to me with a label that reads Ascda. Fuchs Sunset X V. Denisoniana-Yellow. My grand mother had two of them. She had both in hanging baskets in medium light. They were misted once a day. The one she still has was doing beautifully. The one she gave me apparently died on her, and she threw it in the trash. Fortunately she doesn’t empty the garbage in the gardening room very often. Two weeks later, I went to throw something away and noticed a rather green plant in the trash. I pulled it out and saw new root growth near the base of the plant. I will admit that a lot of the roots were dried and very dead looking, but the plant was doing better in the dark dry trash can under the table than it had when it was being taken care of. As far as I understood from her, the plant was a hybrid. Is is possible that two of the same species require such different care? Or that in being a hybrid it ended up with different characteristics than its sibling? She aquired them from a man who used to breed orchids and is now passed when his widow couldn’t care for them. Any thoughts or advice on what I can do to keep it alive are welcome. Thank You.
Response:
Plants are just like most other critters – some are healthy and some are sickly. It’s usually not a drastic difference, and is best seen in a large population of plants. Another point here is that very small differences in conditions can have a drastic effect on the growth, and that can really be amplified when the differences exist when the plants are very young. If you ever driven by a wheat field and seen the huge differences in the plants from one area of the fields to another, you’ll see my point. — Ray Barkalow < First Rays Orchids http://www.firstrays.com Secure Online Ordering & Lots of Free Info!
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Let me preface this with: I know almost nothing about orchids. I got this one because I rescued it from the garbage can. The plant was given to me with a label that reads Ascda. Fuchs Sunset X V. Denisoniana-Yellow. My grand mother had two of them. She had both in hanging baskets in medium light. They were misted once a day. The one she still has was doing beautifully. The one she gave me apparently died on her, and she threw it in the trash. Fortunately she doesn’t empty the garbage in the gardening room very often. Two weeks later, I went to throw something away and noticed a rather green plant in the trash. I pulled it out and saw new root growth near the base of the plant. I will admit that a lot of the roots were dried and very dead looking, but the plant was doing better in the dark dry trash can under the table than it had when it was being taken care of. As far as I understood from her, the plant was a hybrid. Is is possible that two of the same species require such different care? Or that in being a hybrid it ended up with different characteristics than its sibling? She aquired them from a man who used to breed orchids and is now passed when his widow couldn’t care for them. Any thoughts or advice on what I can do to keep it alive are welcome. Thank You.
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Question:
Potassium chloride is not good for the heart apparently, it’s one of the chemical they use in the lethal injection cocktail when they execute people in the US.
‘Pends where you put it, Scotty. Pot. chloride is what’s used in those "salt substitutes". It’s when you put in in your veins in high concentration that it stuffs up the electrical activity of the main pump. Regards John Riley West Oz
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I won’t pretend to know if the small amount of sodium ions are enough to damage your lawn. I use a water softener to exchange the calcium & magnesium in my water, prior to running the water into a reverse osmosis unit that I use for my aquariums & for drinking water. Sodium ions tends to not clog R/O membranes as rapidly as calcium ions. I have done a lot of research on softeners just recently, & have read a lot about the associated risks of excess sodium consumption by humans. Whether it is a real problem or not depends on which information you read. The easiest solution to the excess sodium issue, assuming it really is an issue, is to replace the Sodium Chloride used for recharging your system with Potassium Chloride. Potassium Chloride will work just fine with virtually all softener resins, from what I have read. It is much better for the environment, as plants all use potassium. The minute levels of sodium or potassium in your softened water are more than likely not going to affect your lawn’s, or your own, health. BUT, think about all the salt going into your septic system, or the public sewer systems. It’s a whole bunch, & there are some valid environmental concerns about it.
Cosidering the amount of salt they use up here in the great white north to keep the roads passable in the wintertime, it hardly makes a difference!! However they are aware of environmental concerns and are testing a number of alternatives to salt application as well as cutting back on the quantity they apply Potassium chloride is not good for the heart apparently, it’s one of the chemical they use in the lethal injection cocktail when they execute people in the US. Scotty — Academic Services, CCS (519) 824-4120 x2556 University of Guelph "If it’s not Scottish it’s CRRRRAAAAAAAPPPPPP!"
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I won’t pretend to know if the small amount of sodium ions are enough to damage your lawn. I use a water softener to exchange the calcium & magnesium in my water, prior to running the water into a reverse osmosis unit that I use for my aquariums & for drinking water. Sodium ions tends to not clog R/O membranes as rapidly as calcium ions. I have done a lot of research on softeners just recently, & have read a lot about the associated risks of excess sodium consumption by humans. Whether it is a real problem or not depends on which information you read. The easiest solution to the excess sodium issue, assuming it really is an issue, is to replace the Sodium Chloride used for recharging your system with Potassium Chloride. Potassium Chloride will work just fine with virtually all softener resins, from what I have read. It is much better for the environment, as plants all use potassium. The minute levels of sodium or potassium in your softened water are more than likely not going to affect your lawn’s, or your own, health. BUT, think about all the salt going into your septic system, or the public sewer systems. It’s a whole bunch, & there are some valid environmental concerns about it. Do a google search on " softener resins potassium chloride or salt", you will have enough reading to make your head spin. David – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I realise that I may have watered my lawn without switching my water softener to bypass. Is the amount of salt in treated water enough to cause damage? I was watering once a week for about an hour in the time leading up to our watering ban last summer. Is this anything to worry about, and is any excess salt enough to cause long-term damage to the sod? The only thing that worries me is that the old softener (which I just replaced) was a fixed-cycle system which regenerated every night whether it was needed or not, so there must have been a fairly high salt level in the water most of the time … Thnks Scotty — Academic Services, CCS (519) 824-4120 x2556 University of Guelph "If it’s not Scottish it’s CRRRRAAAAAAAPPPPPP!"
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how much sodium is a function of how much calcium is in the water to start with. Ingrid
Don’t be shy, Ingrid, tell us the function. There are two sodium ions exchanged for every calcium or magnesium ion. Right? 
Regards John Riley West Oz
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how much sodium is a function of how much calcium is in the water to start with. Ingrid The amount of sodium that would accumulate in less than one season of watering is unlikely to create a problem.
List manager- Puregold http://puregold.aquaria.net/ http://users.megapathdsl.net/~solo/solo/index.html Solve the problem, dont waste energy looking for who’s to blame Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other compensation for all the work, endorsements and recommendations I make. And my husband has the bills to prove it!
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Ditto, I have a culligan system and never had any salt related problems, houseplant or outdoors. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Scotty, Just to confirm, if your softener is working properly there is no salt in the water coming from the tap. It is used to clean the membrane and then flushed out in the backwash. I definitely would go to bypass though, or you’ll go thru a lot of salt based on the usage. The other option is to adjust the volume at which your softener cycles, but I don’t think the Culligan man would bless that. I used softened water on my garden (when the wife forgot to bypass) in Ottawa this summer without any noticeable problems. Theo Weber I realise that I may have watered my lawn without switching my water softener to bypass. Is the amount of salt in treated water enough to cause damage? I was watering once a week for about an hour in the time leading up to our watering ban last summer. Is this anything to worry about, and is any excess salt enough to cause long-term damage to the sod? The only thing that worries me is that the old softener (which I just replaced) was a fixed-cycle system which regenerated every night whether it was needed or not, so there must have been a fairly high salt level in the water most of the time … Thnks Scotty
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While there is little sodium chloride (table salt) in the water from your softener, it does replace the calcium and magnesium ions in the incoming water with sodium ions. That is its purpose. A sufficient accumulation of sodium can be come toxic to plants. The amount of sodium that would accumulate in less than one season of watering is unlikely to create a problem. If there is good subsoil drainage and you get enough rains to saturate the soil at least once or twice a year, the sodium will leach out of the soil. Poorly drained soils, and areas so dry that the soil is never saturated, are prone to phytotoxic accumulations of sodium and other salts. Steve Dunlop Nerstrand, MN, USA http://www2.bitstream.net/~dunlop
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I realise that I may have watered my lawn without switching my water softener to bypass. Is the amount of salt in treated water enough to cause damage? I was watering once a week for about an hour in the time leading up to our watering ban last summer. Is this anything to worry about, and is any excess salt enough to cause long-term damage to the sod? The only thing that worries me is that the old softener (which I just replaced) was a fixed-cycle system which regenerated every night whether it was needed or not, so there must have been a fairly high salt level in the water most of the time … Thnks Scotty — Academic Services, CCS (519) 824-4120 x2556 University of Guelph "If it’s not Scottish it’s CRRRRAAAAAAAPPPPPP!"
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The new softener I have is a Culligan Medalist, and the bypass valve is just a slider, not one of those handles which sieze up and break off eventually So I’ll just make sure I dont forget to flip the switch and not worry about toxic salt effects. In this part of the country it’s SOP to plumb outside spigots into the CW line before the softener. Seems like a good idea to me.
I’d like to do that too, but unfortunately my softener is the exact opposite side of the house from the hose spigots .. the extra piping involved wouldn’t be worth the bother. 
Scotty — Academic Services, CCS (519) 824-4120 x2556 University of Guelph "If it’s not Scottish it’s CRRRRAAAAAAAPPPPPP!"
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The new softener I have is a Culligan Medalist, and the bypass valve is just a slider, not one of those handles which sieze up and break off eventually So I’ll just make sure I dont forget to flip the switch and not worry about toxic salt effects.
In this part of the country it’s SOP to plumb outside spigots into the CW line before the softener. Seems like a good idea to me. Mike Prager Beaufort, NC (on the coast in zone 
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Scotty, Just to confirm, if your softener is working properly there is no salt in the water coming from the tap. It is used to clean the membrane and then flushed out in the backwash. I definitely would go to bypass though, or you’ll go thru a lot of salt based on the usage. The other option is to adjust the volume at which your softener cycles, but I don’t think the Culligan man would bless that. I used softened water on my garden (when the wife forgot to bypass) in Ottawa this summer without any noticeable problems.
Actually there is a tiny amount .. some of the the sodium ions do get washed off the resin particles and end up in the drinking water. But the amount is extremely low. The salt is used to recharge the resin particles with sodium ions – these ions swap with magnesium and calcium ions hence removing the hardness from the water. The new softener I have is a Culligan Medalist, and the bypass valve is just a slider, not one of those handles which sieze up and break off eventually So I’ll just make sure I dont forget to flip the switch and not worry about toxic salt effects. Scotty — Academic Services, CCS (519) 824-4120 x2556 University of Guelph "If it’s not Scottish it’s CRRRRAAAAAAAPPPPPP!"
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Scotty, Just to confirm, if your softener is working properly there is no salt in the water coming from the tap. It is used to clean the membrane and then flushed out in the backwash. I definitely would go to bypass though, or you’ll go thru a lot of salt based on the usage. The other option is to adjust the volume at which your softener cycles, but I don’t think the Culligan man would bless that. I used softened water on my garden (when the wife forgot to bypass) in Ottawa this summer without any noticeable problems. Theo Weber – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I realise that I may have watered my lawn without switching my water softener to bypass. Is the amount of salt in treated water enough to cause damage? I was watering once a week for about an hour in the time leading up to our watering ban last summer. Is this anything to worry about, and is any excess salt enough to cause long-term damage to the sod? The only thing that worries me is that the old softener (which I just replaced) was a fixed-cycle system which regenerated every night whether it was needed or not, so there must have been a fairly high salt level in the water most of the time … Thnks Scotty
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Never had experience with water softeners, Scotty, but what does your softened water taste like?
A whole lot less lumpy.
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I realise that I may have watered my lawn without switching my water softener to bypass. Is the amount of salt in treated water enough to cause damage? I was watering once a week for about an hour in the time leading up to our watering ban last summer. Is this anything to worry about, and is any excess salt enough to cause long-term damage to the sod? The only thing that worries me is that the old softener (which I just replaced) was a fixed-cycle system which regenerated every night whether it was needed or not, so there must have been a fairly high salt level in the water most of the time … Thnks Scotty I know several people whose sprinkler systems are down line from the water softner hasn’t damaged their lawn and gardens. Uses a lot of salt though. If you’re growing orchids, I recommend you use the bypass water.
Yep, no orchids, but I will be putting it on bypass just to be safe Scotty — Academic Services, CCS (519) 824-4120 x2556 University of Guelph "If it’s not Scottish it’s CRRRRAAAAAAAPPPPPP!"
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I realise that I may have watered my lawn without switching my water softener to bypass. Is the amount of salt in treated water enough to cause damage? I was watering once a week for about an hour in the time leading up to our watering ban last summer. Is this anything to worry about, and is any excess salt enough to cause long-term damage to the sod? The only thing that worries me is that the old softener (which I just replaced) was a fixed-cycle system which regenerated every night whether it was needed or not, so there must have been a fairly high salt level in the water most of the time … Thnks Scotty
I know several people whose sprinkler systems are down line from the water softner hasn’t damaged their lawn and gardens. Uses a lot of salt though. If you’re growing orchids, I recommend you use the bypass water.
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I realise that I may have watered my lawn without switching my water softener to bypass. Is the amount of salt in treated water enough to cause damage? I was watering once a week for about an hour in the time leading up to our watering ban last summer.
[ .. ] Never had experience with water softeners, Scotty, but what does your softened water taste like? If you can’t taste the salt, then it shouldn’t bother your lawn. WHO say no more than 500 ppm in drinking water and this is fine for irrigation.
You can taste it, but it’s almost impreceptable. There are a few grasses that are not very salt tolerant — Kentucky bluegrass, chewing’s fescue, and colonial bent. They are cool-season grasses of which I have no experience. Leaching is the cure if you have a problem, and maybe some gypsum, but if it looks alright, it should be fine.
Have blugrass lawn .. Just tryin to figure out if it was the direct sun exposure most of the summer and/or the salt from the softener which caused the brown, dry spots on the lawn. My 4 cents (AU). Regards John Riley West Oz
My devalued groat (SCO) Scotty — Academic Services, CCS (519) 824-4120 x2556 University of Guelph "If it’s not Scottish it’s CRRRRAAAAAAAPPPPPP!"
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I realise that I may have watered my lawn without switching my water softener to bypass. Is the amount of salt in treated water enough to cause damage? I was watering once a week for about an hour in the time leading up to our watering ban last summer. Is this anything to worry about, and is any excess salt enough to cause long-term damage to the sod? The only thing that worries me is that the old softener (which I just replaced) was a fixed-cycle system which regenerated every night whether it was needed or not, so there must have been a fairly high salt level in the water most of the time … Thnks Scotty
Never had experience with water softeners, Scotty, but what does your softened water taste like? If you can’t taste the salt, then it shouldn’t bother your lawn. WHO say no more than 500 ppm in drinking water and this is fine for irrigation. There are a few grasses that are not very salt tolerant — Kentucky bluegrass, chewing’s fescue, and colonial bent. They are cool-season grasses of which I have no experience. Leaching is the cure if you have a problem, and maybe some gypsum, but if it looks alright, it should be fine. My 4 cents (AU). Regards John Riley West Oz
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I realise that I may have watered my lawn without switching my water softener to bypass. Is the amount of salt in treated water enough to cause damage? I was watering once a week for about an hour in the time leading up to our watering ban last summer. Is this anything to worry about, and is any excess salt enough to cause long-term damage to the sod? The only thing that worries me is that the old softener (which I just replaced) was a fixed-cycle system which regenerated every night whether it was needed or not, so there must have been a fairly high salt level in the water most of the time … Thnks Scotty — Academic Services, CCS (519) 824-4120 x2556 University of Guelph "If it’s not Scottish it’s CRRRRAAAAAAAPPPPPP!"
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Question:
Hi Julia–You dont have to cut the flower spike unless it dies. If the plant is in good shape and you feed it from time to time, the spike sometimes sends out a new shoot with more flowers. <Phil
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Hello all. I have an orchid of the phalaenopsis variety, and the flowers are now dying. I just bought the orchid about 2 months ago, and was told I would have to cut the stem once all the flowers died. IS THIS TRUE? I made a post to "bionet.plants" and was
OK Julia, first of all Phalaenopsis is a genus, variety has another meaning, more specific than a species. As to your question, we tend to leave things alone if possible. The stem to cut would be the flower stem, please don’t cut anything on the part with the leaves. I don’t think the difference will be confusing with a Phalaenopsis. —
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If it is a strong, healthy plant, you could cut the raceme just above t third "node" from the plant. Some will say just above the node BELOW t first flower formed…(they’re usually the same for me). This may indu reblooming, but takes a lot of energy.
I’ve got one with 2 good-sized buds and 1 maybe growing now off of a spike from just above the 3rd node (where the previous flower spike was). This is my first phal so I am happy that it looks like it will bloom again. Is there something I can do now to get it to produce more buds? I’ve been using Peters’s 30-10-10 orchid food diluted for use every time I water the plant. Also, I’m thinking that after this bloom that maybe I should cut the spike off at the base of the plant so that it can rest. Good idea? Someday we’ll look back on this & it will all seem funny.
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I just bought the orchid about 2 months ago, and was told I would have to cut the stem once all the flowers died. IS THIS TRUE? I made a post to "bionet.plants" and was told to cut the stem off at the location of the flower spike. I can only assume this is where the flowers *were*. Any help would be appreciated!
If it is a strong, healthy plant, you could cut the raceme just above the third "node" from the plant. Some will say just above the node BELOW the first flower formed…(they’re usually the same for me). This may induce reblooming, but takes a lot of energy. If it’s not, cut it at its origin. Either way, use a clean, sterile blade.
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Hello all. I have an orchid of the phalaenopsis variety, and the flowers are now dying. I just bought the orchid about 2 months ago, and was told I would have to cut the stem once all the flowers died. IS THIS TRUE? I made a post to "bionet.plants" and was told to cut the stem off at the location of the flower spike. I can only assume this is where the flowers *were*. Any help would be appreciated! Thanks. Julia
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Rick/Diana/Cindy & Mason, Thanks for all your advice. I’ll keep it in mind. Alina
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all, I’m fairly new to this hobby of growing orchids and have encountered a problem that I need help with. For Christmas I was given 3 Phalaenopsis orchids planted together in a large clay pot and have noticed that 5 flower buds have since withered and turned yellow. The rest of the blooms appear to be okay for the time being. I’ve been told that these orchid plants were repotted just before they were purchased. Would this have caused shock to the orchid since they were already in bloom? Also I live in Toronto Canada and have been finding the air in my house very dry due to the winter weather and central heating. Any tips to increase the humidity? I’ve just added a portable humidifier to the room, increased watering and placed the orchids on a gravel tray. I just want to make sure the rest of the buds flower successfully. Any help provided would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
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First, let me say welcome to the group. This is a great place to share as well as gain knowledge on your new ‘hobby’. Now, my experience with Phals is that any change in their environment can cause the buds and blooms to ‘blast’. This could be temperature, humidity, light, even going from a warm greenhouse and into the cold on the way to the car. Although it can be quite disappointing, it is not harmful to the orchid. I would like to suggest that you look up culture info on Phals, as well as read posts from the more experienced growers on this site. Seems as though you are headed in the right direction with the changes you have already made. Cindy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all, I’m fairly new to this hobby of growing orchids and have encountered a problem that I need help with. For Christmas I was given 3 Phalaenopsis orchids planted together in a large clay pot and have noticed that 5 flower buds have since withered and turned yellow. The rest of the blooms appear to be okay for the time being. I’ve been told that these orchid plants were repotted just before they were purchased. Would this have caused shock to the orchid since they were already in bloom? Also I live in Toronto Canada and have been finding the air in my house very dry due to the winter weather and central heating. Any tips to increase the humidity? I’ve just added a portable humidifier to the room, increased watering and placed the orchids on a gravel tray. I just want to make sure the rest of the buds flower successfully. Any help provided would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
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You’re on the right track re: humidity, and the change in environment can definitely cause bud blast. What is your interior avg temp, and how much light and what kind are the Phals getting? Phals are "low light" plants, but that doesn’t mean "no sunlight". What medium are they planted in, and how do you water? Diana
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Chin, Not to make you think that I even have enough knowledge to be giving information on this newsgroup; but I did purchase a Phalaenopsis last month from a local Home Depot here in Illinois and after 2 weeks, I lost 4 of the original 10 buds. The change in plants surroundings have a great deal to do with the way they respond. Most likly this is what is going on with your Phalaenopsis. I’m sure more experienced folks will chime in and give you a better answer/ hope this helps for now. Wishing the world and all members an Happy New Year. — Stress not over the little things; and the large ones will disappear! Rick~ Hi all, I’m fairly new to this hobby of growing orchids and have encountered a problem that I need help with. For Christmas I was given 3 Phalaenopsis orchids planted together in a large clay pot and have noticed that 5 flower buds have since withered and turned yellow. The rest of the blooms appear to be okay for the time being. I’ve been told that these orchid plants were repotted just before they were purchased. Would this have caused shock to the orchid since they were already in bloom? Also I live in Toronto Canada and have been finding the air in my house very dry due to the winter weather and central heating. Any tips to increase the humidity? I’ve just added a portable humidifier to the room, increased watering and placed the orchids on a gravel tray. I just want to make sure the rest of the buds flower successfully. Any help provided would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
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Chin, Not to make you think that I even have enough knowledge to be giving information on this newsgroup; but I did purchase a Phalaenopsis last month from a local Home Depot here in Illinois and after 2 weeks, I lost 4 of the original 10 buds. The change in plants surroundings have a great deal to do with the way they respond. Most likly this is what is going on with your Phalaenopsis. I’m sure more experienced folks will chime in and give you a better answer/ hope this helps for now. Wishing the world and all members an Happy New Year. — Stress not over the little things; and the large ones will disappear! Rick~
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all, I’m fairly new to this hobby of growing orchids and have encountered a problem that I need help with. For Christmas I was given 3 Phalaenopsis orchids planted together in a large clay pot and have noticed that 5 flower buds have since withered and turned yellow. The rest of the blooms appear to be okay for the time being. I’ve been told that these orchid plants were repotted just before they were purchased. Would this have caused shock to the orchid since they were already in bloom? Also I live in Toronto Canada and have been finding the air in my house very dry due to the winter weather and central heating. Any tips to increase the humidity? I’ve just added a portable humidifier to the room, increased watering and placed the orchids on a gravel tray. I just want to make sure the rest of the buds flower successfully. Any help provided would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
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Hi all, I’m fairly new to this hobby of growing orchids and have encountered a problem that I need help with. For Christmas I was given 3 Phalaenopsis orchids planted together in a large clay pot and have noticed that 5 flower buds have since withered and turned yellow. The rest of the blooms appear to be okay for the time being. I’ve been told that these orchid plants were repotted just before they were purchased. Would this have caused shock to the orchid since they were already in bloom? Also I live in Toronto Canada and have been finding the air in my house very dry due to the winter weather and central heating. Any tips to increase the humidity? I’ve just added a portable humidifier to the room, increased watering and placed the orchids on a gravel tray. I just want to make sure the rest of the buds flower successfully. Any help provided would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
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Question:
Welcome to the hobby and happy growing. In addition to the above mentioned references which I continue to use after several years of growing, I also found the introductory book given with membership in the American Orchid Society to be very helpful. I believe it is also for sale through their book store. Have fun!
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – http://www.orchidmall.com/plants2.htm#canada The orchid mall also has a listing of suggested reading. But for a beginner, Ortho has a very basic book, at paperback prices in the states it is available at Home Depot or Lowes. You can try your local nursery. http://www.ottawaorchidsociety.com/ I am sure there is help here. Good luck SuE Hi Everyone: I’m just trying to start raising Orchids and am looking for reputable suppliers in Canada or ones that will ship to Canada. I am looking for seeds and plants I am also looking for recommendations of books for the beginner. Thanks R. Weisbloom
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Hi Everyone: I’m just trying to start raising Orchids and am looking for reputable suppliers in Canada or ones that will ship to Canada. I am looking for seeds and plants I am also looking for recommendations of books for the beginner. Thanks R. Weisbloom
I don’t think that you have any idea of what it takes to grow an orchid from seed or for that matter how it takes to get a blooming size plant from a seedling. I suggest that for starting out you stick with the "simple" ones such as Phals, Paphs and Cymbidiums! Get good, labeled plants in bloom and if you can make them rebloom then you are well on the way to becomming an orchid grower. Don’t get me wrong I encourage you to grow ochids they are fascinating and exotic and at the same time demanding in their culture and their needs. If you live near a city, the best place to look for plants and books is at the local orchid society. Good luck and welcome to the wacky wonderful world of orchids. Just remember one thing: There is ALWAYS room for one more! — Gideon Singer In Beautiful wet Vancouver BC My website:http://members.home.net/gsinger/index.html
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Hi Everyone: I’m just trying to start raising Orchids and am looking for reputable suppliers in Canada or ones that will ship to Canada. I am looking for seeds and plants I am also looking for recommendations of books for the beginner. Thanks R. Weisbloom
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Look at the Orchid Mall http://www.orchidmall.com and the AOS webpage http://orchidweb.org for suppliers in Canada. Books: Ortho’s ‘All About Growing Orchids’ ($12USD) Home Orchid Growing by Rebecca Northen ($40 or more USD) Orchid Growing Basics by Gustav Schoser ($12USD) The Ortho book is available online at all online bookstores (Amazon. Powells) The Northen book is daunting, but it *is* the bible. We all would ask fewer questions if we’d look it up there first…OUCH!!! That sounds like a dig but I didn’t mean it that way. But I’m always amazed at what I find in that book. She’s rather like the Julia Child of teh orchid world… K Barrett – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Everyone: I’m just trying to start raising Orchids and am looking for reputable suppliers in Canada or ones that will ship to Canada. I am looking for seeds and plants I am also looking for recommendations of books for the beginner. Thanks R. Weisbloom
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http://www.orchidmall.com/plants2.htm#canada The orchid mall also has a listing of suggested reading. But for a beginner, Ortho has a very basic book, at paperback prices in the states it is available at Home Depot or Lowes. You can try your local nursery. http://www.ottawaorchidsociety.com/ I am sure there is help here. Good luck SuE – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Everyone: I’m just trying to start raising Orchids and am looking for reputable suppliers in Canada or ones that will ship to Canada. I am looking for seeds and plants I am also looking for recommendations of books for the beginner. Thanks R. Weisbloom
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: …..I play bridge and Magic (a fantasy card game), rollerblade, volunteer, : write poetry and short stories, read, and believe in the oft-quoted : Heinlein piece about what an adult person should be (a renaissance : person), and have therefore flown a plane, swum in an ocean, given : public speeches, been a leader and a follower, been active in political : campaigns, vote, and can: do plumbing, drywall, fix the brakes (and : other things) on my car, change a diaper, cook a gourmet meal, speak : four languages, play a musical instrument, electrical wiring, roofing, : sew my own clothing, bandage wounds properly, decorate a home, select a : good bottle of wine, do laundry, clean properly, swim quite a distance, : tell a good joke, listen well, build furniture, cut hair, etc. –you get : the idea……. Wow! I’m 10 Celsius. I’m a cranberry grower, among other things, and envy you your free time…
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Hi Tennis, I knew a girl named "Porsche" when I was a teen. I suppose it fit. Your short autobiography was interesting. So I guess I can do one of my own. Rod C. Venger 45 5′6 125 pounds I live in Colorado Springs I own my home I am loved by thousands Hated by more Born with a GOLD spoon in my mouth. Now let others worry about spoons My calls are screened I’d rather give something away than sell it Long red hair green eyes Face reconstructed after a bout with cancer. No chin, 1/2 of jaw. Lifetime underachiever – IQ very high, ambition very low. Computer geek since 1980 Jack of all trades, master of none Dad taught me much about Orchids when I was a kid Started and ran Venger’s Orchids from 1992-1999 Now volunteer as a counselor to other head and neck cancer patients. Am producing a documentary on head and neck cancers. Am (was) into high-priced art. I have 13 Siamese cats I have 3 kids I have one wife I have a reef tank I’ve read everything Heinlein ever wrote. I remember little of it. Or anything else. I was in the military in the 70’s Dunno what more there is to say… -Rod- Who am I and What Is My Gender???
Rod C. Venger – Head and Neck Cancer Support T4N0M0 – Facial Reconstructions, 2-5-99, 3-13-00 Photo and (coming soon)info: http:/www.vengers.com/model.jpg Donations needed for HNO documentary equipment! Call 1-800-483-6437 to donate for DV Tapes and Lighting
Response:
Phew!!! Tennis, I just knew you are one in a million!!! *grin* Cheers Wendy
: : Who am I and What Is My Gender??? : : Tennis, and I find the gender question irrelevant, misleading, and : insulting. Less significant than haircolor, and people get so distracted : and misled by it. : : Where am I??? : : Ohio, USA (40N,83W) : : What do I grow??? : : Over 1300 orchids of all kinds (plus a bunch of compots of deflasked : seedlings), percentagewise more slippers, phals, and trichopilias than : others. Outdoors in the warm weather, indoors in two growrooms in the : cold. : : : The decade of my age??? : : : fourth : : : How long have I been growing orchids??? : : over 23 years : : : My biggest orchid accomplishment??? : : : Learning to relax and enjoy. For a high-strung, temperamental person, : this is a major achievement. And the fact that, by and large, the : people in the orchid community are the nicest, most generous folk I’ve : run into has helped make that possible and restored much of my flagging : faith in humanity. : : : Miscellanious Info… : : : I spend as much time as I can with my four shar-peis (down from twelve : when I was breeding), am a vegetarian, am a religious person (though the : details I think everyone should keep to themselves as I can’t imagine : anything as personal and intensely private as one’s relationship with : one’s deity) work six evenings a week, barely have time to tie my shoes, : and have a web page that eats up even more of my time at: : http://www.orchidcourt.com : : I play bridge and Magic (a fantasy card game), rollerblade, volunteer, : write poetry and short stories, read, and believe in the oft-quoted : Heinlein piece about what an adult person should be (a renaissance : person), and have therefore flown a plane, swum in an ocean, given : public speeches, been a leader and a follower, been active in political : campaigns, vote, and can: do plumbing, drywall, fix the brakes (and : other things) on my car, change a diaper, cook a gourmet meal, speak : four languages, play a musical instrument, electrical wiring, roofing, : sew my own clothing, bandage wounds properly, decorate a home, select a : good bottle of wine, do laundry, clean properly, swim quite a distance, : tell a good joke, listen well, build furniture, cut hair, etc. –you get : the idea–nothing anyone couldn’t do, but so many don’t bother to even : try. I just can’t understand folks who don’t get as much out of life as : they can and be the most that they can, whatever that is. As Marc Antony : said of Octavian in Cleopatra: "When he dies, he will be the only man to : do so without ever having lived." How sad this can be said of so many. : Growiing orchids is about passion. So is life. :
Response:
Who am I and What Is My Gender??? Tennis, and I find the gender question irrelevant, misleading, and insulting. Less significant than haircolor, and people get so distracted and misled by it. Where am I???
Ohio, USA (40N,83W) What do I grow???
Over 1300 orchids of all kinds (plus a bunch of compots of deflasked seedlings), percentagewise more slippers, phals, and trichopilias than others. Outdoors in the warm weather, indoors in two growrooms in the cold. The decade of my age???
fourth How long have I been growing orchids???
over 23 years My biggest orchid accomplishment???
Learning to relax and enjoy. For a high-strung, temperamental person, this is a major achievement. And the fact that, by and large, the people in the orchid community are the nicest, most generous folk I’ve run into has helped make that possible and restored much of my flagging faith in humanity. Miscellanious Info…
I spend as much time as I can with my four shar-peis (down from twelve when I was breeding), am a vegetarian, am a religious person (though the details I think everyone should keep to themselves as I can’t imagine anything as personal and intensely private as one’s relationship with one’s deity) work six evenings a week, barely have time to tie my shoes, and have a web page that eats up even more of my time at: http://www.orchidcourt.com I play bridge and Magic (a fantasy card game), rollerblade, volunteer, write poetry and short stories, read, and believe in the oft-quoted Heinlein piece about what an adult person should be (a renaissance person), and have therefore flown a plane, swum in an ocean, given public speeches, been a leader and a follower, been active in political campaigns, vote, and can: do plumbing, drywall, fix the brakes (and other things) on my car, change a diaper, cook a gourmet meal, speak four languages, play a musical instrument, electrical wiring, roofing, sew my own clothing, bandage wounds properly, decorate a home, select a good bottle of wine, do laundry, clean properly, swim quite a distance, tell a good joke, listen well, build furniture, cut hair, etc. –you get the idea–nothing anyone couldn’t do, but so many don’t bother to even try. I just can’t understand folks who don’t get as much out of life as they can and be the most that they can, whatever that is. As Marc Antony said of Octavian in Cleopatra: "When he dies, he will be the only man to do so without ever having lived." How sad this can be said of so many. Growiing orchids is about passion. So is life.
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Question:
Thanks. Hate feeling like I misled anyone, however unintentionally.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Don’t worry. You got it right. __ Ken Woodward ___ ____Newton, MA___ http://kwoodward.net I will stand corrected if I got the explanation wrong (happens all the time). I don’t think that blueberries are harvested the same way, though. I’m not going to risk another strange look from my hubby by asking for clarification, however. BG Diana Hmmm, we have a local cranberry expert and I wonder if he would say that cranberries grow with constantly wet feet? They tend to grow in sand over a hard substrate and they are flooded for easy harvest. Anyway, he could tell us if he wasn’t out harvesting….. Maybe he will anyway. I love this NG. From orchid addiction and confessions to a discussion of whether blueberries can grow in bogs. Anyhoo, I just asked my husband (he grew up on a farm in north central CT) about the growing habits of blueberries. He says they can grow around the edges of bogs, but they can’t have constantly wet feet like cranberries. Cranberries grew wild on his family’s farm, and blueberries grew near, but not in the midst of them. BTW, he looked at me reeeaaallly funny when I asked the question. We can’t grow blueberries in south FL, not worth a lick, anyway. Welcome, Marty. Do you see the insanity you’ve joined? VBG. Diana
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Hey Ray, I don’t like cranberries, I do like blueberries. Of course, you are right, commercial growers raise in sandy soil, but they never raised either around where I grew up. Corn , beans, oats, etc. were the crops. I do think if you do a google search you will find that species of blueberries do grow on and around bogs. What kinds of berries they have, I don’t know. I can only imagine that commercial blueberry plants have been highly hybridized. Stephen – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Now, Stephen… Your last statement worries me about your level of success If you’d been a farmer: cranberries – not blueberries – grow in a bog. They prefer really sandy soil and lots of air to the roots. — Ray Barkalow < First Rays Orchids http://www.firstrays.com Secure Online Ordering & Lots of Free Info! Well, I was actually thinking of illegal crops. Some minds never run the straight and narrow. Makes Johnny a dull boy. That being said, I was raised in a farming community and I did(notice past tense) know people who made really good money as grain farmers. Others in the same area always had none. Some were good farmers, others weren’t, some had good land, some didn’t. Too many variables went into it. Needless to say, on an orchid discussion group, I don’t think it needs to be carried any further. Cause if I lived on a bog, I’d raise blueberries. Stephen No but I did! I know one can make money on an illegal crop. Did he say legal anywhere? Reka Phaius schrieb: Well true, what legal crops can you think of that are making farmers a fortune?
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I have finally found a cure for orchid fever. It is the bill that you get from the college or university that your child attends. It’s either orchids or UCLA, so I just have to putter around with my current orchids and try new things like coir or Jerry’s new formula. Diane
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I love this NG. From orchid addiction and confessions to a discussion of whether blueberries can grow in bogs. Anyhoo, I just asked my husband (he grew up on a farm in north central CT) about the growing habits of blueberries. He says they can grow around the edges of bogs, but they can’t have constantly wet feet like cranberries. Cranberries grew wild on his family’s farm, and blueberries grew near, but not in the midst of them. BTW, he looked at me reeeaaallly funny when I asked the question. We can’t grow blueberries in south FL, not worth a lick, anyway. Welcome, Marty. Do you see the insanity you’ve joined? VBG. Diana
Response:
Hmmm, we have a local cranberry expert and I wonder if he would say that cranberries grow with constantly wet feet? They tend to grow in sand over a hard substrate and they are flooded for easy harvest. Anyway, he could tell us if he wasn’t out harvesting….. Maybe he will anyway.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I love this NG. From orchid addiction and confessions to a discussion of whether blueberries can grow in bogs. Anyhoo, I just asked my husband (he grew up on a farm in north central CT) about the growing habits of blueberries. He says they can grow around the edges of bogs, but they can’t have constantly wet feet like cranberries. Cranberries grew wild on his family’s farm, and blueberries grew near, but not in the midst of them. BTW, he looked at me reeeaaallly funny when I asked the question. We can’t grow blueberries in south FL, not worth a lick, anyway. Welcome, Marty. Do you see the insanity you’ve joined? VBG. Diana
Response:
I will stand corrected if I got the explanation wrong (happens all the time). I don’t think that blueberries are harvested the same way, though. I’m not going to risk another strange look from my hubby by asking for clarification, however. BG Diana
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hmmm, we have a local cranberry expert and I wonder if he would say that cranberries grow with constantly wet feet? They tend to grow in sand over a hard substrate and they are flooded for easy harvest. Anyway, he could tell us if he wasn’t out harvesting….. Maybe he will anyway. I love this NG. From orchid addiction and confessions to a discussion of whether blueberries can grow in bogs. Anyhoo, I just asked my husband (he grew up on a farm in north central CT) about the growing habits of blueberries. He says they can grow around the edges of bogs, but they can’t have constantly wet feet like cranberries. Cranberries grew wild on his family’s farm, and blueberries grew near, but not in the midst of them. BTW, he looked at me reeeaaallly funny when I asked the question. We can’t grow blueberries in south FL, not worth a lick, anyway. Welcome, Marty. Do you see the insanity you’ve joined? VBG. Diana
Response:
Don’t worry. You got it right. __ Ken Woodward ___ ____Newton, MA___ http://kwoodward.net
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I will stand corrected if I got the explanation wrong (happens all the time). I don’t think that blueberries are harvested the same way, though. I’m not going to risk another strange look from my hubby by asking for clarification, however. BG Diana Hmmm, we have a local cranberry expert and I wonder if he would say that cranberries grow with constantly wet feet? They tend to grow in sand over a hard substrate and they are flooded for easy harvest. Anyway, he could tell us if he wasn’t out harvesting….. Maybe he will anyway. I love this NG. From orchid addiction and confessions to a discussion of whether blueberries can grow in bogs. Anyhoo, I just asked my husband (he grew up on a farm in north central CT) about the growing habits of blueberries. He says they can grow around the edges of bogs, but they can’t have constantly wet feet like cranberries. Cranberries grew wild on his family’s farm, and blueberries grew near, but not in the midst of them. BTW, he looked at me reeeaaallly funny when I asked the question. We can’t grow blueberries in south FL, not worth a lick, anyway. Welcome, Marty. Do you see the insanity you’ve joined? VBG. Diana
Response:
: He says they can grow around the edges of bogs, but they can’t : have constantly wet feet like cranberries….. It depends on the time of year (for cranberries). When dormant (after mid-August in the Northern Hemisphere), standing water on the subsrate isn’t particularly deleterious to vine health. When growth is apparent, damp feet (whatever that may mean) causes root death, poor production, and ‘fruit drop’. Dale Borders – in Bandon, OR. Where cranberry production is frightenly abundant and federally mandated crop reduction is closely monitored. ……and where Pteroceras semiteretifolia, Brachionidium folsomii, and Dendrobium bilamellatum promise imminent photo opportunities.
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Tell me about the greenhouse. I’m so excited with mine and my learning curve is going up fast. It would be fun to share with another new greenhouse owner.
Hey Frank, My greenhouse is 9′ x 14′ made of wood and polycarb, with a gravel floor. The ventilation is an 16" attic fan on a thermostat on one end and on the other is a 3′ x 4′ window. In that window I installed an evaporative cooler pad that stays wet via a water cooler pump in a bucket on the floor. The sides of the greenhouse are 4′ plywood insulated with 1 3/4" Styrofoam, 3′ above that is clear polycarb. The roof is opaque (white) polycarb. In the summer I used 50% shade cloth which I raised about 6" above the surface of the roof using 1" PVC pipe. Raising the shade cloth off the surface of the roof allows air to pass through, thus cooling the temp of the air before it reaches the greenhouse. I live in S. California and we had some hot days, the hottest being 109 degrees! To combat those hot days I installed a PVC pipe with foggers down the center of the greenhouse where I have no orchids growing (yet!), so as not to over water my plants. I was able to hold the temps on the very hottest days to no more than upper 80’s, low 90’s. Everything has survived nicely, even my cymbidiums which I keep on my porch under shade. Orchids are tough!! And yes, in case your wondering, I also have a 20" box fan to circulate the air — Marty Shipps I never met an orchid I didn’t like or a cookie I wouldn’t eat!
Response:
The rate of your infection is frightening! It took me eight years to build my greenhouse which was just completed.
Well slap me with a wet Sarcochilus. Ive been collecting for just over 12 months and I am already looking at buying a farm just to support them all. Where did I go wrong??? Kye.
Response:
You think a FARM will support them??? What century are you from? Trying to make money on a farm is almost as bad as trying to make money selling orchids!
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The rate of your infection is frightening! It took me eight years to build my greenhouse which was just completed. Well slap me with a wet Sarcochilus. Ive been collecting for just over 12 months and I am already looking at buying a farm just to support them all. Where did I go wrong??? Kye.
Response:
I will tell you both what I learned the first year in my greenhouse: forget all of the cultural habits you employed while growing orchids in your home. Everything is now different and you will have to relearn it all. Your indoor watering pattern will be the first causality, but all the environmental factors will be different now and you will see that the way everything grows changed after the move. You can never have too many fans. Al – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The rate of your infection is frightening! It took me eight years to build my greenhouse which was just completed. I hope you enjoy the passion for orchids as much as I do and that they reward you with frequent blooms, great beauty, and minimal frustration. I’ve found this group to be friendly and helpful. :-) Tell me about the greenhouse. I’m so excited with mine and my learning curve is going up fast. It would be fun to share with another new greenhouse owner. Have fun, Frank Greetings all, My name is Marty and I have a confession. Sometime in June 2000, I succumbed to an incurable affliction known as orchid fever. Since then my life has been consumed with reading and learning everything I can about orchids. Hence, that is why I decided to join this newsgroup in the quest for my thirst of knowledge (sound good so far?). Since, I bought my first Phalaenopsis 14 months ago, I have acquired approximately 100 orchids and completed building my greenhouse in August 2001. I look forward to exchanging ideas, thoughts, accomplishments and failures with all that care to reply. Marty Shipps — I never met an orchid I didn’t like or a cookie I wouldn’t eat!
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I can tell you exactly where and when you went wrong. It happened when you first noticed an orchid and didn’t keep on walking. The moment your interest was first piqued, you were lost. It isn’t too late, throw them on the compost pile and walk away!!! Spartacus
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The rate of your infection is frightening! It took me eight years to build my greenhouse which was just completed. Well slap me with a wet Sarcochilus. Ive been collecting for just over 12 months and I am already looking at buying a farm just to support them all. Where did I go wrong??? Kye.
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I’m a newbie to Orchids, too, Marty. Bought my first Phal one a year ago and (rescued/adopted) another just last week. I am beginning to belive that orchids are much like cats and dogs, just cannot turn away a stray or deny one a rescue.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Greetings all, My name is Marty and I have a confession. Sometime in June 2000, I succumbed to an incurable affliction known as orchid fever. Since then my life has been consumed with reading and learning everything I can about orchids. Hence, that is why I decided to join this newsgroup in the quest for my thirst of knowledge (sound good so far?). Since, I bought my first Phalaenopsis 14 months ago, I have acquired approximately 100 orchids and completed building my greenhouse in August 2001. I look forward to exchanging ideas, thoughts, accomplishments and failures with all that care to reply. Marty Shipps — I never met an orchid I didn’t like or a cookie I wouldn’t eat!
Response:
No but I did! I know one can make money on an illegal crop. Did he say legal anywhere? Reka Phaius schrieb: Well true, what legal crops can you think of that are making farmers a fortune?
Response:
I can tell you exactly where and when you went wrong. It happened when you first noticed an orchid and didn’t keep on walking. The moment your interest was first piqued, you were lost. It isn’t too late, throw them on the compost pile and walk away!!!
Nah Id have nightmares for weeks and need to go out and rescue them constantly. Hell I get up through the night most nights just to check the temperature in the bushhouse…. Kye.
Response:
Now, Stephen… Your last statement worries me about your level of success If you’d been a farmer: cranberries – not blueberries – grow in a bog. They prefer really sandy soil and lots of air to the roots. — Ray Barkalow < First Rays Orchids http://www.firstrays.com Secure Online Ordering & Lots of Free Info!
Well, I was actually thinking of illegal crops. Some minds never run the straight and narrow. Makes Johnny a dull boy. That being said, I was raised in a farming community and I did(notice past tense) know people who made really good money as grain farmers. Others in the same area always had none. Some were good farmers, others weren’t, some had good land, some didn’t. Too many variables went into it. Needless to say, on an orchid discussion group, I don’t think it needs to be carried any further. Cause if I lived on a bog, I’d raise blueberries. Stephen No but I did! I know one can make money on an illegal crop. Did he say legal anywhere? Reka Phaius schrieb: Well true, what legal crops can you think of that are making farmers a fortune?
Response:
Well, I was actually thinking of illegal crops. Some minds never run the straight and narrow. Makes Johnny a dull boy. That being said, I was raised in a farming community and I did(notice past tense) know people who made really good money as grain farmers. Others in the same area always had none. Some were good farmers, others weren’t, some had good land, some didn’t. Too many variables went into it. Needless to say, on an orchid discussion group, I don’t think it needs to be carried any further. Cause if I lived on a bog, I’d raise blueberries. Stephen No but I did! I know one can make money on an illegal crop. Did he say legal anywhere? Reka Phaius schrieb: Well true, what legal crops can you think of that are making farmers a fortune?
Response:
Well true, what legal crops can you think of that are making farmers a fortune?
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well now, a lot depends on what you are growing on your farm!!!! Spartacus You think a FARM will support them??? What century are you from? Trying to make money on a farm is almost as bad as trying to make money selling orchids! The rate of your infection is frightening! It took me eight years to build my greenhouse which was just completed. Well slap me with a wet Sarcochilus. Ive been collecting for just over 12 months and I am already looking at buying a farm just to support them all. Where did I go wrong??? Kye.
Response:
Well now, a lot depends on what you are growing on your farm!!!! Spartacus
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You think a FARM will support them??? What century are you from? Trying to make money on a farm is almost as bad as trying to make money selling orchids! The rate of your infection is frightening! It took me eight years to build my greenhouse which was just completed. Well slap me with a wet Sarcochilus. Ive been collecting for just over 12 months and I am already looking at buying a farm just to support them all. Where did I go wrong??? Kye.
Response:
Well, I guess I am the guilty party here as Marty is one of my customers. Marty has been attending our orchid society and has even won ribbons already! His next step will be to accept a position on the board! LOL Marty, glad to see you found "RGO" (Rec.Gardens.Orchids), welcome aboard! Matthew Swift Swift’s Orchids www.swiftsorchids.com
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Greetings all, My name is Marty and I have a confession. Sometime in June 2000, I succumbed to an incurable affliction known as orchid fever. Since then my life has been consumed with reading and learning everything I can about orchids. Hence, that is why I decided to join this newsgroup in the quest for my thirst of knowledge (sound good so far?). Since, I bought my first Phalaenopsis 14 months ago, I have acquired approximately 100 orchids and completed building my greenhouse in August 2001. I look forward to exchanging ideas, thoughts, accomplishments and failures with all that care to reply. Marty Shipps — I never met an orchid I didn’t like or a cookie I wouldn’t eat!
Response:
The rate of your infection is frightening! It took me eight years to build my greenhouse which was just completed. I hope you enjoy the passion for orchids as much as I do and that they reward you with frequent blooms, great beauty, and minimal frustration. I’ve found this group to be friendly and helpful. :-) Tell me about the greenhouse. I’m so excited with mine and my learning curve is going up fast. It would be fun to share with another new greenhouse owner. Have fun, Frank
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Greetings all, My name is Marty and I have a confession. Sometime in June 2000, I succumbed to an incurable affliction known as orchid fever. Since then my life has been consumed with reading and learning everything I can about orchids. Hence, that is why I decided to join this newsgroup in the quest for my thirst of knowledge (sound good so far?). Since, I bought my first Phalaenopsis 14 months ago, I have acquired approximately 100 orchids and completed building my greenhouse in August 2001. I look forward to exchanging ideas, thoughts, accomplishments and failures with all that care to reply. Marty Shipps — I never met an orchid I didn’t like or a cookie I wouldn’t eat!
Response:
You are in trouble now, boy!! There’s no turning back!! K Barrett – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Greetings all, My name is Marty and I have a confession. Sometime in June 2000, I succumbed to an incurable affliction known as orchid fever. Since then my life has been consumed with reading and learning everything I can about orchids. Hence, that is why I decided to join this newsgroup in the quest for my thirst of knowledge (sound good so far?). Since, I bought my first Phalaenopsis 14 months ago, I have acquired approximately 100 orchids and completed building my greenhouse in August 2001. I look forward to exchanging ideas, thoughts, accomplishments and failures with all that care to reply. Marty Shipps — I never met an orchid I didn’t like or a cookie I wouldn’t eat!
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Marty — welcome aboard! My name is Jean, and I am an orchidholic, too. Started with one, and within six months had acquired over fifty with much damage to the checkbook :-/ It’s a wonderful obsession and, combined with another obsession, such as African violets, can completely consume every minute of your spare time and quickly encroach upon work time, as well. All I care about is rushing home to reconfigure my light stands etc. When your bookshelf is full and you’ve printed out everything you can find on the internet and bound it all into reference booklets and binders, give me a shout and maybe we can trade the plants we acquired before we knew we couldn’t successfully provide the right environment for them…! Jean – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Greetings all, My name is Marty and I have a confession. Sometime in June 2000, I succumbed to an incurable affliction known as orchid fever. Since then my life has been consumed with reading and learning everything I can about orchids. Hence, that is why I decided to join this newsgroup in the quest for my thirst of knowledge (sound good so far?). Since, I bought my first Phalaenopsis 14 months ago, I have acquired approximately 100 orchids and completed building my greenhouse in August 2001. I look forward to exchanging ideas, thoughts, accomplishments and failures with all that care to reply. Marty Shipps — I never met an orchid I didn’t like or a cookie I wouldn’t eat!
Response:
Greetings all, My name is Marty and I have a confession. Sometime in June 2000, I succumbed to an incurable affliction known as orchid fever. Since then my life has been consumed with reading and learning everything I can about orchids. Hence, that is why I decided to join this newsgroup in the quest for my thirst of knowledge (sound good so far?). Since, I bought my first Phalaenopsis 14 months ago, I have acquired approximately 100 orchids and completed building my greenhouse in August 2001. I look forward to exchanging ideas, thoughts, accomplishments and failures with all that care to reply. Marty Shipps — I never met an orchid I didn’t like or a cookie I wouldn’t eat!
Response:
Question:
That’s a nice read. Just right for a guy with a little college science but no hard science degress <Grin. Searching around the web I did come up with an interesting couple of links: 1. Fertilizers in Reverse Osmosis Water http://www.msu.edu/user/harveyb/Fertilizers.htm 2. The Wellesteins’ piece Water Quality Issues for Slipper Orchid Growers http://www.ladyslipper.com/waterq.htm 3. John Talpa et al at Orchid Safari archives’ Water Quality Questions and Answers http://www.geocities.com/brassia.geo/watrqual.html Love to hear from others on the subject. Adios, RJ
Response:
RJ (bender boy) spake thusly: For the RO Water: 1. PH – 5.5 2. TDS – 0
Eees very good water. For the Tap Water 1.PH – 7.5 2.TDS – 310
Ees not so good water. I’d noticed in the past that during cooler months our water has a more "chalky" taste to it and this seems to confirm it. Do you all think most of this hardness is coming from Calcium Nitrate?
Er, only if you’re adding it. You might mean calcium carbonate, in which case I’d say "probably" only if I could confirm you had a water source that involved limestone at some point in time. What else could it be. The utility company says if I want more info I’d have to pay for a lab to do it.
Your water company is either very small, or very small-minded. Go to: http://www.epa.gov/safewater/ and you can find all kinds of info. As they note under "Drinking water info," "Each year by July 1 you should receive in the mail a short report (consumer confidence report) from your water supplier that tells where your water comes from and what’s in it." They have a link you can click on to see if it’s on-line. There are many wonderful things the government will happly splurge your money on (look for an anti-boxcutter ray on the latest space-based missile defense bill), and- dammit, if it’s information, there’d better be a way to retrieve it. It’s all and good for your water supply to be able to tell you the MCL of arsenic is 0.05 mg/L, the high level detected was 0.015 mg/L, with a range of <0.005 to 0.015 mg/L as our water supply does. On-line. Along with everything else from barium to chloroform, and coliform bacteria to polyhalomethanes. The City of Chandler, AZ really goes overboard, and I am damned proud of it. Sadly, tragically, unfortunately, there is the possibility that your water supply consists of Ed and Joe, one of whom answers the telephone, and the other of which has a large wrench and knows how to use it. Beyond that, their functionality lacks the same zest and vigor of a telemarketer sweatshop. How much does this usually run and is it really necessary?
How big is a rock? Depends upon what you’re looking for. If all you need is pH and hardness, well- you already bought the meter. If you want a breakdown of all the cations and anions, you might spend $50 or more. If you want to know organic contaminants, heavy metals, and a coliform count (none of which will facilitate the production of orchids), you’ll spend another $150 or so. In short, no- it’s probably not necessary. If you pay for water coming out of your tap, it’s probably not going to hurt you. Seriously. People whine and carp about smell, taste, and appearance, but tap water from commercial sources in the US is pretty damned good. Aside from arsenic, the federal regulations are sufficient. Now, this doesn’t mean the water is ideal for ALL orchids ALL the time. You can’t expect to grow disas with tap water in Arizona. There are limits, and don’t expect anyone to give you specific parameters for ALL orchids under ALL conditions. If they do, they’re either full of it, or a hell of a lot better at growing orchids than I’ll ever be. Six hundred genera, and they always know what’s best? Hmm. Lastly, is it a good idea to put the RO in a box plastic container and add enough tap water to get the PH to 6.5 (ideal for nutrient absorption) even if my TDS goes up a litte? How does one calculate and perform the necessary titration?
I would say no. Here’s what you should do: Water your orchids thoroughly, and collect the waste water. Measure THAT pH. Here’s why. Pure water has a pH around 5.4 to 5.6, because carbon dioxide dissolves in it. It’s slightly acid, but has no buffering capacity. This means a drop of acid, or a drop of alklai, will cause the pH to swing radically. A solution with a high TDS will take much more to cause a pH change. It’s like trying to change air temperature, rather than water temperature: Raising the air temperature in an empty room takes very little heat. Raising the temperature in the same room, full of WATER, takes a lot more. Now, if you pour slightly acidic RO water on your orchids, the MEDIA will dictate the pH of your water. Now, if you go pouring water with 100 ppm of TDS at pH 6.0 every single time on your bark, eventually it will get close to pH 6.0 (bacterial action will change this, but play along for now, or stop reading). If you use 1000 ppm of TDS at the same pH, it’ll change faster. Still with me? Now, go backwards- use TDS = 0, and it’ll take forever to change that bark. The media will dictate the pH- and, hell, this is what you’re after anyway, right? Absorption occurs at the root zone, IN THE MEDIA, not in the bucket of fertilizer you’re going to throw on them. Now, without expensive monitoring equipment, you’re not going to get the pH at the root zone, and you don’t need to (orchids aren’t fussy- shotgun approach to nutrition is all you need). But you’ll get darned close to it by measuring your drain water pH. This message has been brought to you by the letter "L." -AJHicks The Orchid Seedbank http://members.home.com/ahicks51/osp Chandler, AZ
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Hey Aaron et al, While we are on this subject, can you post some references online and maybe a book for laymen on the subject of water and its chemical properties when used for plants, drinking, etc? I’d love to learm more, especially about how roots interact with PH and how adding nutrients to low-buffering-capacity water like RO affects different parameters. Thanks, RJ
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While we are on this subject, can you post some references online and maybe a book for laymen on the subject of water and its chemical properties when used for plants, drinking, etc?
No. Er, uh, this is to say, there really aren’t any (that I know of). There’s a good primer I wrote a few years back with the help of other Teeming Millions. It has PhD approval from UCLA. ftp://ftp.nmt.edu/pub/orchids/water1.5 I’d love to learm more, especially about how roots interact with PH and how adding nutrients to low-buffering-capacity water like RO affects different parameters. Thanks, RJ
Good luck. A single-parameter system is pretty simple. A fixed concentration of compound X in pure water has a pH of Z. However, variable concentrations of X plus Y gives you something completely different. Now, imagine emptying a bucketload of nutrients into your water. Around about the time you’re putting in the 8th parameter, you’re ripping out your hair and considering going into daytrading as an occupation. If you are capable of entertaining all these parameters simultaneously, let me know; I have a buddy who needs help formulating the nth generation of orchid media. Cheers, -AJHicks The Orchid Seedbank http://members.home.com/ahicks51/osp Chandler, AZ
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Thanks guys. You are real fountains of knowledge. I’ll run the water through a couple of pots and retest to see what happens. I’m pretty curious to see what it does. RJ
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You get to use your water chemistry education about as often as I. You are right, I was assuming (perhaps erroniously) that the sample was fresh and had not had an extended time for CO2 to diffuse in, and carbonic acid to reach equilibrium. I stuck the old pool strips into the surface of my RO trashcan and got an approximate value in the low 6’s. A crude test to be sure. The water has been sitting for a couple of days with a little stirring. TZ – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Pure water (which is about what a steam still or RO filter gives you) by definition has a pH of 7. If your RO filter is giving you grossly different values (like pH 5.5) it is either malfunctioning (which in your case would give you pH of about 7.5), or your meter is not calibrated right. It could possibly drop to 5.5 AFTER you add fertilizer. Pure distilled or deionized water (or high-quality reverse osmosis water) will have a pH of 7.0 as it comes out of the nozzle, yes. However, there is carbon dioxide in the air, despite the lingering doubts of the current administration. Atmospheric concentration of carbon dioxide is around 320-360 parts per million. Carbon dioxide dissolves in water, following this equation: H2O + CO2 <– H2CO3 Water + carbon dioxide gives you carbonic acid (H2CO3). Carbonic acid is a weak acid. Read all about it: http://newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/chem99/chem99661.htm At atmospheric concentrations, at ambient pressure, the concentration of carbonic acid is just enough to shift the pH of distilled water from 7.0 to between 5.4 and 5.6. However, this requires pure water. This is why rain is naturally *slightly* acidic, and how caves form (the slightly acidic nature of the water from rainfall and surface sources dissolves limestone). Although I would not necessarily rule out membrane problems if the original poster reported a pH of 5.5, but in conjunction with TDS of zero (or close to it), unless the meter were malfunctioning, this is typical- pure water is slightly acidic upon standing. The data fit. This is about the only thing I remember from my time in graduate school in groundwater geochemistry. It comes in useful about once a year. Cheers, -AJHicks The Orchid Seedbank http://members.home.com/ahicks/osp Chandler, AZ
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TZ, It doesn’t take long for CO2 to change the pH. A good example is a lab setup that I installed. This system started with RO water and then went into laboratory grade deionization cartridges. In a running stream, the meter showed 18 megohm water. (High purity water is tested by resistivity rather than conductivity.) Then, I removed the sample from the stream, set it on the table, and took a second reading 30 seconds later. The water was down to 5 megohms. This gives you some idea of how fast the water quality degrades. The test strips you used were designed for a buffered solution. They do not work on straight RO water. The reagent in the strip will change the pH of the water on the strip giving a false pH reading. To get an accurate reading, you need to have test paper that is designed for low ion concentration. Hope this helps, John G. Talpa, CWS-VI Certified Water Specialist JT Company
You get to use your water chemistry education about as often as I. You are right, I was assuming (perhaps erroniously) that the sample was fresh and had not had an extended time for CO2 to diffuse in, and carbonic acid to reach equilibrium. I stuck the old pool strips into the surface of my RO trashcan and got an approximate value in the low 6’s. A crude test to be sure. The water has been sitting for a couple of days with a little stirring. TZ
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Pure water (which is about what a steam still or RO filter gives you) by definition has a pH of 7. If your RO filter is giving you grossly different values (like pH 5.5) it is either malfunctioning (which in your case would give you pH of about 7.5), or your meter is not calibrated right. It could possibly drop to 5.5 AFTER you add fertilizer. Pure distilled or deionized water (or high-quality reverse osmosis water) will have a pH of 7.0 as it comes out of the nozzle, yes. However, there is carbon dioxide in the air, despite the lingering doubts of the current administration. Atmospheric concentration of carbon dioxide is around 320-360 parts per million. Carbon dioxide dissolves in water, following this equation: H2O + CO2 <– H2CO3 Water + carbon dioxide gives you carbonic acid (H2CO3). Carbonic acid is a weak acid. Read all about it: http://newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/chem99/chem99661.htm At atmospheric concentrations, at ambient pressure, the concentration of carbonic acid is just enough to shift the pH of distilled water from 7.0 to between 5.4 and 5.6. However, this requires pure water. This is why rain is naturally *slightly* acidic, and how caves form (the slightly acidic nature of the water from rainfall and surface sources dissolves limestone). Although I would not necessarily rule out membrane problems if the original poster reported a pH of 5.5, but in conjunction with TDS of zero (or close to it), unless the meter were malfunctioning, this is typical- pure water is slightly acidic upon standing. The data fit. This is about the only thing I remember from my time in graduate school in groundwater geochemistry. It comes in useful about once a year. Cheers, -AJHicks The Orchid Seedbank http://members.home.com/ahicks/osp Chandler, AZ
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Pure water (which is about what a steam still or RO filter gives you) by definition has a pH of 7. If your RO filter is giving you grossly different values (like pH 5.5) it is either malfunctioning (which in your case would give you pH of about 7.5), or your meter is not calibrated right. It could possibly drop to 5.5 AFTER you add fertilizer.
Pure distilled or deionized water (or high-quality reverse osmosis water) will have a pH of 7.0 as it comes out of the nozzle, yes. However, there is carbon dioxide in the air, despite the lingering doubts of the current administration. Atmospheric concentration of carbon dioxide is around 320-360 parts per million. Carbon dioxide dissolves in water, following this equation: H2O + CO2 <– H2CO3 Water + carbon dioxide gives you carbonic acid (H2CO3). Carbonic acid is a weak acid. Read all about it: http://newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/chem99/chem99661.htm At atmospheric concentrations, at ambient pressure, the concentration of carbonic acid is just enough to shift the pH of distilled water from 7.0 to between 5.4 and 5.6. However, this requires pure water. This is why rain is naturally *slightly* acidic, and how caves form (the slightly acidic nature of the water from rainfall and surface sources dissolves limestone). Although I would not necessarily rule out membrane problems if the original poster reported a pH of 5.5, but in conjunction with TDS of zero (or close to it), unless the meter were malfunctioning, this is typical- pure water is slightly acidic upon standing. The data fit. This is about the only thing I remember from my time in graduate school in groundwater geochemistry. It comes in useful about once a year. Cheers, -AJHicks The Orchid Seedbank http://members.home.com/ahicks/osp Chandler, AZ
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Pure water (which is about what a steam still or RO filter gives you) by definition has a pH of 7. If your RO filter is giving you grossly different values (like pH 5.5) it is either malfunctioning (which in your case would give you pH of about 7.5), or your meter is not calibrated right. It could possibly drop to 5.5 AFTER you add fertilizer. RO filters are not perfect, so you should still be reading a TDS of 2-10 depending on what TDS you started with. Another reason to check the meter. Hardness is a measure of calcium carbonate (limestone) and magnesium carbonate (dolomite) dissolved in the water. Any nitrate in the water would most likely come from agricultural runnoff with its origin as ammonium nitrate, or breakdown of urea based fertilizer and/or livestock excretion of urea, not commercially manufactured calcium nitrate. I don’t think that the hardness value affects the taste of the water too much. yours is lower than mine by 25%, and I don’t see much taste difference from my RO or distilled water. Chlorine and other impurities impart more flavor. As for your titration. Assuming that your RO filter works, you are starting at pH 7, add your fertilizer at the dose you feel is appropriate for your plants, and test for pH, if it falls below 6.3 add tap water to raise the pH to 6.3-6.8. You have a pH meter so just keep testing with each cup of water. Yoiu could also add Dyna-Grom Pro-Tek to bring up the pH. Have you looked for a more complete water quality report fom a nearby area that sinks wells into the the same groundwater source? If not, try here http://www.awwa.org/utility.cfm hope this helps, TZ – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – To our water experts: Last time I posted the analysis from our Water Utility. The data were as follows: 1. Cl2 – 1.0 2. PO4 – 2.0 3. Iron – 0 4. Magnesium – 0 5. PH – 7.4 6. Hardness – 153.9 I have since obtained a Hanna Instrument Agritest 1 probe (the one with the dual PH/TDS probe) and after properly calibrating it using their solutions I get the following resuls: For the RO Water: 1. PH – 5.5 2. TDS – 0 For the Tap Water 1.PH – 7.5 2.TDS – 310 I’d noticed in the past that during cooler months our water has a more "chalky" taste to it and this seems to confirm it. Do you all think most of this hardness is coming from Calcium Nitrate? What else could it be. The utility company says if I want more info I’d have to pay for a lab to do it. How much does this usually run and is it really necessary? Lastly, is it a good idea to put the RO in a box plastic container and add enough tap water to get the PH to 6.5 (ideal for nutrient absorption) even if my TDS goes up a litte? How does one calculate and perform the necessary titration? Thanks, RJ
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As usual Aaron, you are a fount of knowledge and like that fount, you sometimes bubble over. Do you drink a lot of soda water? <g
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – RJ (bender boy) spake thusly: For the RO Water: 1. PH – 5.5 2. TDS – 0 Eees very good water. For the Tap Water 1.PH – 7.5 2.TDS – 310 Ees not so good water. I’d noticed in the past that during cooler months our water has a more "chalky" taste to it and this seems to confirm it. Do you all think most of this hardness is coming from Calcium Nitrate? Er, only if you’re adding it. You might mean calcium carbonate, in which case I’d say "probably" only if I could confirm you had a water source that involved limestone at some point in time. What else could it be. The utility company says if I want more info I’d have to pay for a lab to do it. Your water company is either very small, or very small-minded. Go to: http://www.epa.gov/safewater/ and you can find all kinds of info. As they note under "Drinking water info," "Each year by July 1 you should receive in the mail a short report (consumer confidence report) from your water supplier that tells where your water comes from and what’s in it." They have a link you can click on to see if it’s on-line. There are many wonderful things the government will happly splurge your money on (look for an anti-boxcutter ray on the latest space-based missile defense bill), and- dammit, if it’s information, there’d better be a way to retrieve it. It’s all and good for your water supply to be able to tell you the MCL of arsenic is 0.05 mg/L, the high level detected was 0.015 mg/L, with a range of <0.005 to 0.015 mg/L as our water supply does. On-line. Along with everything else from barium to chloroform, and coliform bacteria to polyhalomethanes. The City of Chandler, AZ really goes overboard, and I am damned proud of it. Sadly, tragically, unfortunately, there is the possibility that your water supply consists of Ed and Joe, one of whom answers the telephone, and the other of which has a large wrench and knows how to use it. Beyond that, their functionality lacks the same zest and vigor of a telemarketer sweatshop. How much does this usually run and is it really necessary? How big is a rock? Depends upon what you’re looking for. If all you need is pH and hardness, well- you already bought the meter. If you want a breakdown of all the cations and anions, you might spend $50 or more. If you want to know organic contaminants, heavy metals, and a coliform count (none of which will facilitate the production of orchids), you’ll spend another $150 or so. In short, no- it’s probably not necessary. If you pay for water coming out of your tap, it’s probably not going to hurt you. Seriously. People whine and carp about smell, taste, and appearance, but tap water from commercial sources in the US is pretty damned good. Aside from arsenic, the federal regulations are sufficient. Now, this doesn’t mean the water is ideal for ALL orchids ALL the time. You can’t expect to grow disas with tap water in Arizona. There are limits, and don’t expect anyone to give you specific parameters for ALL orchids under ALL conditions. If they do, they’re either full of it, or a hell of a lot better at growing orchids than I’ll ever be. Six hundred genera, and they always know what’s best? Hmm. Lastly, is it a good idea to put the RO in a box plastic container and add enough tap water to get the PH to 6.5 (ideal for nutrient absorption) even if my TDS goes up a litte? How does one calculate and perform the necessary titration? I would say no. Here’s what you should do: Water your orchids thoroughly, and collect the waste water. Measure THAT pH. Here’s why. Pure water has a pH around 5.4 to 5.6, because carbon dioxide dissolves in it. It’s slightly acid, but has no buffering capacity. This means a drop of acid, or a drop of alklai, will cause the pH to swing radically. A solution with a high TDS will take much more to cause a pH change. It’s like trying to change air temperature, rather than water temperature: Raising the air temperature in an empty room takes very little heat. Raising the temperature in the same room, full of WATER, takes a lot more. Now, if you pour slightly acidic RO water on your orchids, the MEDIA will dictate the pH of your water. Now, if you go pouring water with 100 ppm of TDS at pH 6.0 every single time on your bark, eventually it will get close to pH 6.0 (bacterial action will change this, but play along for now, or stop reading). If you use 1000 ppm of TDS at the same pH, it’ll change faster. Still with me? Now, go backwards- use TDS = 0, and it’ll take forever to change that bark. The media will dictate the pH- and, hell, this is what you’re after anyway, right? Absorption occurs at the root zone, IN THE MEDIA, not in the bucket of fertilizer you’re going to throw on them. Now, without expensive monitoring equipment, you’re not going to get the pH at the root zone, and you don’t need to (orchids aren’t fussy- shotgun approach to nutrition is all you need). But you’ll get darned close to it by measuring your drain water pH. This message has been brought to you by the letter "L." -AJHicks The Orchid Seedbank http://members.home.com/ahicks51/osp Chandler, AZ
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I would hazard that it most certainly is not primarily from calcium nitrate. Your water supplier would never be allowed to have that high of a nitrate level in tap water and you wouldn’t be able to drink it without negative health effects. Most likely the hardness is the result of calcium and/or magesium carbonate and bicarbonate. You could add back some tap water to your RO product water to raise the pH, or you could empirically add small amounts of base (I use potassium hydroxide), keeping track of how much you add for what volume of water, until you reach the pH you desire. Remember, your pH will not be what the RO water’s pH is originally, after you add fertilizer. You need to add the fertilizer and then measure and adjust pH. There’s another issue that’s harder to quantify. The pH that really counts is the pH of the "soil solution" at a plant’s root surface. It is hard to measure, and would not necessarily be the same as the pH of the water you irrigate with. That’s because the medium in the pot, existing salts from previous fertilizer application, and probably other factors will modify the pH of the irrigation water. There may be quite a buffering effect. So, no one really knows exactly the pH that their plants experience. We are all guessing. Personally, I wouldn’t have a problem watering my plants with pH 5.5 RO water, because it has virtually no buffering capacity and the pH of the soil solution will very likely be higher. The "ideal" pH range is from 5.5 – 6.5.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – To our water experts: Last time I posted the analysis from our Water Utility. The data were as follows: 1. Cl2 – 1.0 2. PO4 – 2.0 3. Iron – 0 4. Magnesium – 0 5. PH – 7.4 6. Hardness – 153.9 I have since obtained a Hanna Instrument Agritest 1 probe (the one with the dual PH/TDS probe) and after properly calibrating it using their solutions I get the following resuls: For the RO Water: 1. PH – 5.5 2. TDS – 0 For the Tap Water 1.PH – 7.5 2.TDS – 310 I’d noticed in the past that during cooler months our water has a more "chalky" taste to it and this seems to confirm it. Do you all think most of this hardness is coming from Calcium Nitrate? What else could it be. The utility company says if I want more info I’d have to pay for a lab to do it. How much does this usually run and is it really necessary? Lastly, is it a good idea to put the RO in a box plastic container and add enough tap water to get the PH to 6.5 (ideal for nutrient absorption) even if my TDS goes up a litte? How does one calculate and perform the necessary titration? Thanks, RJ
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To our water experts: Last time I posted the analysis from our Water Utility. The data were as follows: 1. Cl2 – 1.0 2. PO4 – 2.0 3. Iron – 0 4. Magnesium – 0 5. PH – 7.4 6. Hardness – 153.9 I have since obtained a Hanna Instrument Agritest 1 probe (the one with the dual PH/TDS probe) and after properly calibrating it using their solutions I get the following resuls: For the RO Water: 1. PH – 5.5 2. TDS – 0 For the Tap Water 1.PH – 7.5 2.TDS – 310 I’d noticed in the past that during cooler months our water has a more "chalky" taste to it and this seems to confirm it. Do you all think most of this hardness is coming from Calcium Nitrate? What else could it be. The utility company says if I want more info I’d have to pay for a lab to do it. How much does this usually run and is it really necessary? Lastly, is it a good idea to put the RO in a box plastic container and add enough tap water to get the PH to 6.5 (ideal for nutrient absorption) even if my TDS goes up a litte? How does one calculate and perform the necessary titration? Thanks, RJ
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Question:
After hearing a number of Bob Gordon’s speeches on phals, I would tend to agree with Karen C. . . . Pam Everything Orchid Management System http://www.pe.net/~profpam/page3.html – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – of wisdom: anyway, is it possible for these two unhealthy plants to flower… IME, unhealthy or even dying plants of all types and species can and often will attempt to flower one last time. It’s kind of their last-ditch way of propagating themselves before they kick the bucket. I’m not saying this is what is happening with your plant (and I certainly hope it isn’t). But it is possible… * * * * * Karen C. Spray away BUGS to e-mail me… "Gardeners know all the best dirt!"
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Is that like Cycnoches doing their swan song?? Enquiring minds want to know. Spartacus
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – of wisdom: anyway, is it possible for these two unhealthy plants to flower… IME, unhealthy or even dying plants of all types and species can and often will attempt to flower one last time. It’s kind of their last-ditch way of propagating themselves before they kick the bucket. I’m not saying this is what is happening with your plant (and I certainly hope it isn’t). But it is possible… * * * * * Karen C. Spray away BUGS to e-mail me… "Gardeners know all the best dirt!"
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ok, i may be mistaken here… but i am pretty sure that my two ‘near death’ orchids have just started sending out bloom stalks.. which are growing pretty fast i might add. I have only been growing orchids for a year now so this is my first season attempting to get them to bloom.. im not sure if you guys remember or not, but i purchased these plants from ebay and really had bad luck with them.. i repotted and tried everything but they never really came back.. as a matter of fact, they have more yellowing leaves than healthy ones at this point.. but for some reason, they seem like they may be going to bloom for me. I have never seen a bloom stalk emerge, so i didnt think i would be able to distinguish it from a root, but i am noticing a difference. these ’stalks’ are sectioned… whereas the roots i have are just all one piece.. . anyway, is it possible for these two unhealthy plants to flower… and all my other orchids be healthy as can be with new roots and leaves, but no sign of blooming? if anything, i give the unhealthy/reject ones less attention.. im bewildered! kim
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Question:
Has anyone out there purchased a Wardian case called the Orchidarium? I am planning to purchase one of the large models for orchids and insectivorous plants but as they are pricey I liked to hear from anyone who owns one. Thanks, Glenn
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Glenn – I haven’t tried one of these myself, but a couple of my friends have (both experienced orchid hobbyists) and they both had similar experiences with them. Orchids can grow very well in them, but they found that the temperature inside the Orchidarium with the lights on would always be at least 10-15 degrees (F) higher than the room temperature. Increasing the ventilation could make that a little better, but would also lower the humidity. If you can keep the Orchidarium in a cool place (normal room temperature of 70-75 degrees) it is great for warm-growing orchids, but be careful not to let it get too dry inside. Kirk Z Madison, Wisconsin, USA – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Has anyone out there purchased a Wardian case called the Orchidarium? I am planning to purchase one of the large models for orchids and insectivorous plants but as they are pricey I liked to hear from anyone who owns one. Thanks, Glenn
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Was that the warm ballast models? I’m thinking of getting one too but I saw that you could choose warm ballast (raises temperatures about 10-15F above ambient) as well as cool (raises temperatures about 0-5F). Hmm… K One inexpensive way to reduce the temperature in an orchidarium is to freeze liter or half liter bottles of water then place them in the bottom of the Orchidarium. I usually use 6 to 8 bottles a night to get a 15 degree day/night differential in temperature. I grow mostly Pleurothallids in mine. I have really been pleased with the performance of both insectivorous plants (Pinguiculas) and orchids in this case. Jon Fayetteville, Arkansas, USA
Jon, Would placing the bottles on top accomplish the same thing? Cold air sinks….having never had a wardian case or Orchidarium, I’m genuinely curious. How about those gel "freezer bags"? Thanks -Rod- Rod & Susan Venger, Venger’s Orchids http://www.vengers.com/ Our IRC (Chat info) http://www.vengers.com/page.htm
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There’s really no place to put them on top near the lights. I put the bottles underneath the shelf and let the fan circulate the air around the Orchidarium. Jon – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Jon, Would placing the bottles on top accomplish the same thing? Cold air sinks….having never had a wardian case or Orchidarium, I’m genuinely curious. How about those gel "freezer bags"? Thanks -Rod- Rod & Susan Venger, Venger’s Orchids http://www.vengers.com/ Our IRC (Chat info) http://www.vengers.com/page.htm
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Was that the warm ballast models? I’m thinking of getting one too but I saw that you could choose warm ballast (raises temperatures about 10-15F above ambient) as well as cool (raises temperatures about 0-5F). Hmm… K
One inexpensive way to reduce the temperature in an orchidarium is to freeze liter or half liter bottles of water then place them in the bottom of the Orchidarium. I usually use 6 to 8 bottles a night to get a 15 degree day/night differential in temperature. I grow mostly Pleurothallids in mine. I have really been pleased with the performance of both insectivorous plants (Pinguiculas) and orchids in this case. Jon Fayetteville, Arkansas, USA
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Has anyone out there purchased a Wardian case called the Orchidarium? I am planning to purchase one of the large models for orchids and insectivorous plants but as they are pricey I liked to hear from anyone who owns one.
Hi Glenn, Rick Jacobs started the company a few years ago and after going through several proto-types, has come out with some great Wardian cases. He’s a personal friend of ours here in Minnesota and a shameless plug for the product is from an objective viewpoint. I know of several persons who have 2 Orchidariums and one person who has FIVE. The woman grows mostly miniatures and every time she shows up at the Orchid Society meetings to put plants up for table judging, there are ribbons galore. The units now have the ability to come with a small micro-fogger unit or a typr of cooling unit. Not familiar with the details though. FWIW Jimm Roberts Roberts Orchids Minnesota – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
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Was that the warm ballast models? I’m thinking of getting one too but I saw that you could choose warm ballast (raises temperatures about 10-15F above ambient) as well as cool (raises temperatures about 0-5F). Hmm… K – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Glenn – I haven’t tried one of these myself, but a couple of my friends have (both experienced orchid hobbyists) and they both had similar experiences with them. Orchids can grow very well in them, but they found that the temperature inside the Orchidarium with the lights on would always be at least 10-15 degrees (F) higher than the room temperature. Increasing the ventilation could make that a little better, but would also lower the humidity. If you can keep the Orchidarium in a cool place (normal room temperature of 70-75 degrees) it is great for warm-growing orchids, but be careful not to let it get too dry inside. Kirk Z Madison, Wisconsin, USA Has anyone out there purchased a Wardian case called the Orchidarium? I am planning to purchase one of the large models for orchids and insectivorous plants but as they are pricey I liked to hear from anyone who owns one. Thanks, Glenn
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – ken, i’m sorry i don’t have answers to your questions. instead i have more questions, as i’ve been thinking about building an orchidarium myself: 1. what materials are you planning on using? glass, plexi? 2. are you creating a frame for it? 3. are you putting hinged doors on it? have you been to www.orchidarium.com? they have supplies which you might include in your own orchidarium: humidifier, fogger, sponges, etc. good luck. chris I’m in the process of building an orchidarium. I’m basically building a 3 foot wide by 2 feet deep by 48 inch high case. I have some spar 96 watt power pc tubes and was thinking about using 2 of them in the system. Would this provide too much light? (the combined bulbs are rated at about 7000 lumens (or foot candles for those who prefer)). Also, what is a good way of providing humidity. I was thinking of using 2 sponges. Finally, I plan on putting in an 85 cfm fan in the case to provide circulation. Would this be sufficient air movement? Thanks in advance, Ken
I’m using cedar as the frame for the case (won’t rot!). It will have a hinged front door. I’ll use a magnet latch and probably put felt around the opening to seal it better. I’m also using plexiglass(acrylic), this stuff is light, cheap and won’t yellow, though you have to be careful because it will scratch. It will be plexiglassed all the way around and bottom. The top will be a cedar hood with the light fixture and fan. Yes , I have been at www.orchidarium.com, that’s why I’m building it my self. A 3 foot unit from them would go for more than what I want to pay. With the pc ballast for the lights, I’m looking at at the tops, 300 dollars to build (not including the lights, I’ve have plenty of used lights from my mini-reef aquarium).
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One way to create humidity in a smaller system is to drop a bubblier stone from an aquarium into a container of water. This water has to be changed often because you will find the salts will build up quickly. In the 70’s we built a case and on the front put in sliding glass doors. To reduce the loss of light we put the reflective film on the glass that some people use for windows or vans. We had plastic coated walls using the available "bathtub surround" paneling. It is basically a case of think outside of the box. I have heard here of some gutter installed in basement rooms to collect and route the overflow from generous watering. I have seen the big aquarium hose used to drain from one tray to the next to the bottom bucket in a light cart. Have fun. SuE – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – ken, i’m sorry i don’t have answers to your questions. instead i have more questions, as i’ve been thinking about building an orchidarium myself: 1. what materials are you planning on using? glass, plexi? 2. are you creating a frame for it? 3. are you putting hinged doors on it? have you been to www.orchidarium.com? they have supplies which you might include in your own orchidarium: humidifier, fogger, sponges, etc. good luck. chris I’m in the process of building an orchidarium. I’m basically building a 3 foot wide by 2 feet deep by 48 inch high case. I have some spar 96 watt power pc tubes and was thinking about using 2 of them in the system. Would this provide too much light? (the combined bulbs are rated at about 7000 lumens (or foot candles for those who prefer)). Also, what is a good way of providing humidity. I was thinking of using 2 sponges. Finally, I plan on putting in an 85 cfm fan in the case to provide circulation. Would this be sufficient air movement? Thanks in advance, Ken
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ken, i’m sorry i don’t have answers to your questions. instead i have more questions, as i’ve been thinking about building an orchidarium myself: 1. what materials are you planning on using? glass, plexi? 2. are you creating a frame for it? 3. are you putting hinged doors on it? have you been to www.orchidarium.com? they have supplies which you might include in your own orchidarium: humidifier, fogger, sponges, etc. good luck. chris – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m in the process of building an orchidarium. I’m basically building a 3 foot wide by 2 feet deep by 48 inch high case. I have some spar 96 watt power pc tubes and was thinking about using 2 of them in the system. Would this provide too much light? (the combined bulbs are rated at about 7000 lumens (or foot candles for those who prefer)). Also, what is a good way of providing humidity. I was thinking of using 2 sponges. Finally, I plan on putting in an 85 cfm fan in the case to provide circulation. Would this be sufficient air movement? Thanks in advance, Ken
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I’m in the process of building an orchidarium. I’m basically building a 3 foot wide by 2 feet deep by 48 inch high case. I have some spar 96 watt power pc tubes and was thinking about using 2 of them in the system. Would this provide too much light? (the combined bulbs are rated at about 7000 lumens (or foot candles for those who prefer)). Also, what is a good way of providing humidity. I was thinking of using 2 sponges. Finally, I plan on putting in an 85 cfm fan in the case to provide circulation. Would this be sufficient air movement? Thanks in advance, Ken
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